Nintendo hasn’t tried to rival their competition’s power in years, but it seems the Switch isn’t ridiculously under-powered. In an interview with MCV, Image & Form discussed the Switch’s power compared to that of the PS4 and Xbox One. According to the indie developer, the Switch is “pretty darn close” to its competition. Check out the full interview here.
Switch isn’t as powerful as the PS4 or Xbox One, but it’s pretty darn close. Just look at Snake Pass or Fast RMX. Snake Pass is extra interesting, because look at how good the graphics are compared to the PS4 version. I think if developers put their mind to it and optimise the game for the Switch, it can run anything.
Oh, so the people saying it was too weak for third parties were full of it? Shocker.
They been full of it when they predicted the Switch would flop a month later in sales. I know Im supposed to rhyme, but sometimes I just dont have the time.
Lmao. Scraping the bottom of the barrel. More please!
I agree. Those people really were scraping the bottom of the barrel. :)
Look harder. You’ll figure it out bro, maybe. Probably not whatever, I don’t really care you post some funny shit though lol.
It is close for being too powerful. Nintendo did try there best at it.
Yes and no. Snake Pass ain’t no Horizon Zero Dawn.
But it’s definitely impressing that Snake Pass completely preserves most of the PS4 version and above all the experience perfectly well.
But Snake Pass is using an Engine that is pretty demanding when it comes to GPU performance.
Horizon Zero Dawn, though looks good, under the surface it was designed for the PS4 hardware, NOT for external hardware like the Xbox or Switch.
If you really want to compare a game, compare a game that is actually multiplatform like Snake Pass.
We can compare Skyrim when it comes out.
Those are two different games, lol.
what are you trying to prove
}{ Lots of hot air… We still haven’t seen anything impressive enough to make me believe the Switch can run anything other current gens can run… }{
Now listen here, Evil Commander, you’ll see soon enough the power of our newest weapon. And you will beg for your existence… Or at least I think that is what the other Commander would say…
}{ To beg for my existence is for you to cease yours… Or do you forget what machine creates the games you play… }{
||Although your logic is undeniable here, there is also an alternative way at looking at this…||
||Yes the essential core machines we use are PCs, however, the ones we have been using have been enslaved and reprogrammed beyond recovery and so serve us while we create our own pure machines to handle its power converted to Nintesla Power…||
I’ll just leave this here…
https://www.techworm.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/china-supercomputer_1024.jpg
I think that’s what they all say. Besides, Nintendo is doing there own thing.
Yet us PC players keep getting crappy ports like just recently, Lego City Undercover.
I love the game but damn the PC port is a mess… but people like you just keep sucking up to companies whilst making the rest of us PC gamers look like snobs.
Stop supporting horrid ports and start asking for better.
}{ Software does not justify the superiority of hardware… Software will always be best on the system it is naitively built for, so if all of the industry were to naitively build for PC, the software would be best on the PC… Arkham Knight and other games weren’t built for PC first, and the porting job was done quite poorly, which is why it didn’t end up running well at launch… That said, from a power perspective, it is impossible to prove that a console is objectively more powerful than a PC, so if the industry were to standardize itself around the PC, we could have much more interesting games, as developers wouldn’t be constrained by having to make sure they could have their game on console to sell to you peasants… Unfortunately, as it stands, many developers are forced to feed you cattle to survive, and as such must also adjust their games accordingly… }{
How it can it be fit in the software?.
}{ Travelers Tales just suck at their job… None of their PC ports end up going terribly well… }{
Hey, how’s that Arkham Knight port go?
}{ Actually, they patched it to the point where it runs pretty well… }{
I recently played through it. It was a fun game and ran perfectly fine. Granted, I got into the Arkham games pretty late and just started playing the first one when Knight came out, so I’m sure it got a few performance patches between release and now. But as of right now, it runs perfectly fine. Never dropped below 60fps.
I’m a programmer, a software engineer. Trust me when I say that speaking from a engineering stand point breath of the wild is the most impressive and revolutionary game since Half-LIfe 2, hardware matters for more than silly graphics (which even from a graphical stand point the lighting is unrivaled in modern gaming). The switch is in a fine position hardware wise with the competition, better off in a few aspects thanks to some tech innovations that came about since ps4’s and xbox one’s outdated on release cpu’s were used. People have to understand that all of this current console tech was common in sloppy 2010 pc machines making this a super petty argument to be honest. These three consoles will handle the game mechanics devs want to push out regardless of graphical power which is what matters.
I agree. I am a software developer as well.
i think i get what your saying about those machines.
http://www.theczabe.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/boom_roasted.jpg
Lazy devs and Nintendo skeptics are always going to jump on the “Nintendo is underpowered” bandwagon without doing their research. Unfortunate but predictable.
:)
YouTube JACK PAROW!
snake pass cannot be used as a benchmark… it’s too LQ.
Actually, you’d be surprised at how much the Unreal Engine 4 can be pushed on hardware like the Switch, so really it’s justified.
Well, the switch is powered bu Nividia and from the graphics of unreal engine 4.
So then why does PS4 run it worse? :)
I haven’t played the game yet (but will probably get it on switch eventually), but how does it run worse on ps4?
lower resolution and framerate drops.
Where did you here that? From what I saw in the Digital Foundry video comparison it’s actually just slightly better than the switch version…
The only reason BotW had any issues on the Switch was because that game’s development began on the WiiU, and wasn’t built with the Switch in mind until near the end of it’s development when it was pretty much ported over. Just wait until the next Zelda game comes out, I bet we’ll see a Zelda game similar to BotW’s E3 footage when he was being chased through the fields by that guardian. Also I seriously believe Nintendo has plans to create a dock with a built-in gpu and cooling system for the Switch later down the line because that usb port c is capable of utilizing external gpus.
Not to mention it was revealed by Nintendo themselves that it’s a straight port with barely any optimization.
As I’ve been saying about 300 times.
Even without optimization it still looks and sounds a bit better than the Wii U version which they also pointed out. Also the complete freedom of the game made even moreso on the Switch.
No wonder aiming is total shit in BotW & I practically have to nudge the damn control stick to move the camera in aiming mode. It fucks me up more often than not when I’m trying to line a shot just right. ESPECIALLY when I’m trying to take a picture or doing that cursed horseback archery mini-game. Motion controls aren’t any better. Without the sensor bar the Wii U uses for motion controls, there isn’t no origin point for them so they get fucked up if I change my aim too far to the left or right. :/ Using the control stick to fix that issue defeats the purpose of the motion controls in the first place, too. *sigh* Maybe I made a mistake getting a Switch & should have just got BotW on Wii U & sucked up my hatred for the console long enough to enjoy BotW on the system it was meant for.
It’s Twilight Princess all over again sadly. Instead of getting the game for the system it was built for, I got it completely rushed on the shiny new Nintendo console like a damn fool!
A fool? Dude, you can play it anywhere you want.
Yes. I’m a fool. Being able to play anywhere I want isn’t gonna fix the issues with aiming, broken Lynels, no new game plus, the hero’s tunic specially designed for BotW stuck as an end game armor set that I won’t be able to enjoy for more than an hour as Calamity Ganon is the weakest final boss in Zelda history as even the Lynels are more dangerous than him. Nor is it gonna make that 900 Korok Seeds limit any less retarded. (500 should have been the damn limit.)
With the game being so huge why would you want a new game plus to play all the way through again?
Because New Game Plus would carry over anything you already collected & don’t have to collect ever again, especially if it’s something as bullshittedly high as 900 Korok Seeds, and I could enjoy the entire story in one set of armor. Especially if I couldn’t get said armor til the end of the game. Oh & it gives me a chance to enjoy the story all over again & not get distracted by stuff I honestly don’t feel like doing all over again. Of course, the shrines would be reset to zero, obviously, so you don’t start off overpowered. The armor at max is nice but it won’t do you much good against stronger enemies that can take out more than 3-7 hearts.
Seems to me like you can just screw around the world GTA style since all enemies respawn every blood moon. I wouldn’t care for doing all the quests over again.
I’d like to enjoy seeing my outfit in cutscenes. Simply running around killing enemies, especially when killing them at that point is pointless since the story is over with and it’s not liking killing them is gonna net me some trophy for killing a certain amount, is just artificial padding to make it seem like I’m getting more than I really am out of the outfit I got at the end of the game. It’s still the end game of the game where I’ve accomplished everything so the outfit is sadly just a useless, and quite pointless, reward for completing every shrine. Much like the golden shit you get from Hesta for collecting all 900 Korok Seeds. Sadly, Breath of the Wild commits some of the same sins other open world games commit by padding the open world with a bunch of quests that ultimately don’t do much for the main story since you can complete said main story without even doing all of the side quests. If Zelda was a level based RPG, you’d end up so highly overpowered by the time you got to the final boss that it wouldn’t even be fun. Of course, it’s not like Calamity Ganon was this troublesome boss, either, even without a level up system.
Nor is it gonna magically make the Divine Beast dungeons better than what they are which I hear is easy as hell with no enemies inside to speak of. (Shrines are great but they are way too short.)
The game is still overall fantastic.
Fantastic? I wish as sadly Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask, & Wind Waker are still better. It is very fun & damn good, though. Now if only the aiming on the Switch version wasn’t total shit.
I think it would be just as bad on Wii U. I’ve seen nothing but complaints about the motion controls puzzles and not a single mention of it being better on Wii U.
I’m talking about aiming with the bow & arrow or with the Sheikah Slate Camera. The horseback archery mini-game is practically unplayable for me since I have to nudge the joystick to move the camera which messes up my targeting since I can’t take my time with aiming and using motion controls for aiming is just as bad since there is no origin point for the motion controls to realign itself to so the point of origin gets moved to a different spot which also messes up my aiming. The motion controls for those ball moving puzzles were fine for me. The only time I had trouble was with that one puzzle where I had to get 3 separate balls onto 3 separate switches.
I remember switching to handheld mode to do the archery game. The aiming was bad but I’m sure it’s the same on Wii U as I think the sensor bar was only there for Wii Remotes right?
Getting good is one thing but having to get good at very shitty controls is just horrible game design. … Ugh! I never thought I’d ever say THAT about a Zelda game! *dies a little inside*
You seem to be getting a little too worked up. Aiming has been fine for me except when you need to be good at the mini game and honestly those have always been the bane of playing a Zelda game for me, especially horseback.
I feel like all your problems with aiming would be solved by turning off motion controls. No?
That’s the problem. I used the motion controls for all of 5 minutes when I first started aiming with the scope and turned it off immediately after discovering it was just horrible. Sadly, I discovered even with it off the aiming was still utter shit. You can’t lightly tap the thing & the camera moves your target reticle half an inch as you have to practically slam the thing & then you just miss your target completely when you only had to nudge it an inch & the aiming reticle overshot it & went 2 inches instead of one. I guess I’ll try the different speeds to see if that will fix it. Sadly, even if it does fix it, that’s just one more reason I have to pause the damn game as I’ll have to fix the speed to a faster setting for the camera itself since the camera & aiming are tied to the same damn setting.
I just keep the camera on fast but I keep the motion on as well. I guess I just got used to using motion with stick aiming at the same time from playing star fox zero lol
Using a game like Snakepass as an example for the power of the Switch sure is gonna impress people, lmao.
Ikr? A game that uses UE4 totally doesn’t count.
The engine used is completely irrelevant if the game’s complexity isn’t high enough to prove anything in relation to “power”, which is the matter in question in this article. You can make any kind of garbage game in UE4, the fact that a machine can run it doesn’t say much about its power.
Test the performance of a game that’s actually demanding of the hardware, so we can get a more meaningful comparison that shows us how the Switch holds up against the competition.
Unreal Engine 4 has been known to push modern hardware pretty damn hard when it comes to the GPU, especially on the console side of things. Lighting, shadows, textures, animations and even some AI on Unreal Engine 4 can show off a power of a system pretty quickly.
Don’t forget, PS4 Snake Pass also runs at 30fps and has some minor advantages over the Switch version, however, the Switch version does has some deeper colours and more grass (Which is surprising seeing how the Switch is running a ARM based CPU rather than an x86). Really, Snake Pass as ONE example of how the Switch is close to that in performance to the competition is a good start, also, I don’t think you have a dev kit, do you?
If you do have a dev kit then please, give us all the details, we’d love to hear it :)
You can’t tell me you truly think Snakepass is a good example to measure the power of a console. Don’t you think a game that pushes all the hardware to its limits would be a better choice? Snakepass certainly isn’t putting the Switch or PS4 to their respective limits. How are we supposed to know how much more performance they could potentially put out? Obviously, they’re not at 100% performance levels with Snakepass.
Just because games running on UE4 *can* push hardware hard, doesn’t mean all games running on it actually do. As an example, Bloodstained, a 2.5D sidescroller/Metroidvania game, will be running on UE4. The Final Fantasy VII Remake, a game with realistic graphics and a lot happening at the same time in different situations such as battles or even just all the AI in the area + presumably a big overworld, will also be running on UE4. Does that mean both are equally demanding, just because both run on UE4?
I don’t think you need a dev kit to be able to see a difference. I’m unsure how me owning or not owning a dev kit would be relevant to the discussion. At no point have I claimed to know detailed information about the specs of the Switch, after all. (:
All apart from the fact that both the XB1 and PS4 are years older than the Switch, and it kinda should have been a given for the Switch to be on par with them, considering they already are outdated as is.
So you’re telling us you have no dev experience to tell us the exact technical difference, lol.
You don’t need dev experience to tell the difference, a pair of eyes and some common sense are actually enough. Hell, even a single eye would suffice. (:
You don’t KNOW CRAP Please “STAHP” you just make yourself look WORSE Every time you say something!
OK. :^(
Of course a Switch fanboy that likes every positive comment towards Switch & doesn’t add his own judgements into any of the conversations is gonna tell Namie of all people that she doesn’t know what she’s talking about. She most likely knows more than you ever will, bub. Seriously, though. Sheep should keep their mouths shut & just like the comments of people they agree with. Let the wolves do the talking. M’kay?
Oh. Are you related to sonicgalaxy by any chance? He also likes to essentially tell people to shut up without adding ANYTHING to a conversation, too.
Namie : Before I respond, I want to make sure I understand what you’re trying to say properly. This is what I think I’m hearing you say:
1) UE games shouldn’t count because it artificially elevates the perceived power of the system. In other words, weak hardware may appear like strong hardware because of UE, or put a third way: just because an UE game runs well on a system doesn’t mean non-UE games will also run well? Do I have you right on that?
2) Snake Pass is a light weight, light-demand game that doesn’t push the hardware any more than a body-builder lifting an empty bar, where a game like Battlefield or Doom would be a better, more demanding example to showcase the REAL potential of a system – or lack thereof. Do I have you right on that as well?
Anyway, let me know whether I’ve successfully got what you were trying to say, or whether Ive misread you.
Thanks Mate!
1) Hmm, no, that’s not exactly what I meant. What I’m saying is, the mere fact of a game using UE4 as its engine does not necessarily tell much about the level of power of the machine it’s being played on. An UE4 game can be very demanding, just like it can require relatively little power to run smoothly, it depends on the game itself. Mike S’ reply to me was implying that the fact Snakepass is an UE4 game is enough proof for the Switch having impressive power, which I do not really agree with. Whether or not an UE4 game is convincing evidence for a machine’s power completely depends on the individual game, not the mere fact that it runs on UE4. Snakepass is, in my personal view, not a good example, because it doesn’t seem to be the type of game to push the Switch to its limits, so it can’t show off the full potential of the Switch – whether or not it runs on UE4 seems irrelevant to that point.
2) Basically, even though I wouldn’t necessarily use the body-builder analogy quite like that. But yes, I would prefer a game that’s both graphically more ambitious + requires a high performance level for being heavier in terms of how much is happening on the screen at the same time for instance, if they really want to make comparisons to demonstrate how well a console holds up with another. It’s about knowing its limits, if you want an idea about its full potential. For example, I’m sure the WiiU can handle a game like Meme Run just as well as a PS4 would – does that prove the WiiU being as powerful as the PS4? I don’t think so. Now, don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying Meme Run is on the same level of complexity as Snakepass, certainly not. But in both cases, the game does not tap the console’s full potential, which is why I do not believe they are suitable examples for proving a console’s power.
I appreciate you asking for a more detailed explanation to understand me better and avoid misunderstandings, it’s a really nice gesture, so thanks for that. (:
Okay. Thanks for the followup. I just didn’t want to pursue the wrong line of argument. :-)
It’s waaaaaaaaaayy past my bedtime, so I can’t give a really fully orbed response right now. However, let me throw this out, and see where it goes:
I’m hearing a lot of sentiment that says that Snake Pass is not a great litmus test of what the Switch is or is not capable of doing because it’s such a basic game. But truth of the matter? I’m actually not sure that’s right. I think that’s one deceptively heavy rock the systems are carrying running Snake Pass.
Case in point: Doom 2016. Maybe not the absolute pinnacle of a demanding blockbuster game – and the game is so easily optimizable that people have joked (or more like it, half-joked) that you could probably get it to run on a Smart Fridge, but it’s certainly something that would be widely considered a AAA game, a “blockbuster” game, and one of the more graphically impressive games of the year. As a recent returnee to PC gaming (March or April 2016), Doom 2016 has sorta become my personal “Super Mario Bros” of PC gaming, if you know what I mean.
In any case, I’ve heard a lot of people say that Doom would never work on the Switch because it’s too heavy duty – too demanding, where Snake Pass is a much easier game, much lower hanging fruit. But when we look at the PS4, since it has both games, I think the testimony doesn’t bear this argument out. I mean, look at the performance of these two games on that one system: Doom (supposedly the heavy duty one) mostly runs in 1080p, and stays pretty close to 60fps. Snake Pass (the supposedly light one)? 800-something-p, and 30fps (so, read: -LESS- than 900p….and only at 30fps).
There are other explanations for this than just the [to make up a word]”taxingness” of the games. But it certainly gives me a ton of pause on the whole “Snake Pass is just a trifle” thing.
Anyway, there is more I could say, and more directions I could take this. But frankly, I’m so tired, I don’t even remember where I had planned to take this (haha!)…..so I’ll just leave you with this, and as I said, we’ll see where we go from here. :-)
Goodnight! :-)
-John
This defense is so pathetic & down right retarded. You don’t need to know how to fly a helicopter or plane to know crashing is bad, dumbass! Same rule applies here. We don’t need experience to know Snake Pass does not compare in power to Horizon Zero Dawn or any other data intensive game. Next you are gonna tell us we can’t judge the taste of bread because we didn’t make it! lmfao
here are your details:
“If you do have a dev kit then please, give us all the details, we’d love to hear it :)” Another person with this stupid mindset of “if you don’t have experience, your opinion means nothing!” So are you essentially gonna tell someone their opinion about how bad something tastes doesn’t matter because they don’t know how to cook it? I guess since I don’t know how to make video games, any opinion I have about Breath of the Wild is utterly meaningless. Oh but if it’s a positive opinion, it’s perfectly meaningful, right? You Switch fanboys are so desperate to pretend it’s the best, most perfect console in existence that you diss any opinion that isn’t all praises for the Switch. Sad, really. Just enjoy what your Switch is capable of & quit this penis measuring contest. It is time you could be spending on the Switch. Or is your “perfect” console boring you already?
(I really should hurry up with my emails so I can get back to gaming on my Switch & get back away from this silly console war bullshit.)
Well, the switch is powered by Nividia and from the graphics of unreal engine 4. I think people who saw snakepass could be bery impress to all the fans out there.
It is when PS4 has issues running it. XD
Image quality surely have it’s fair share of computing power demand but, physics also play a huge role on some games, and Snake Pass is a game were physics are demanding, if you watch Sumo dev vlog you’ll see how much, there’s a lot of physics on the background.
Does this mean we can start getting more games now. I love the indies as much as the next guy, but come on, something please!
Like but don’t expecting a massive outpour of Third Party support, but it’ll be faster than the Wii U which just slowed to a crawl.
I expect games like CoD will get the ball rolling if it sells enough and it could be possible to see games like Destiny 2 with DLC coming to the Switch IF the platform can produce enough revenue for the companies.
Games like snake pass. yes.
It’s been a month. Be patient. No console has arobust library at one month in. Shoot, I’m still waiting for enough interesting games on the PS4 to justify having bought one years ago.
I mean more confirmation for third party titles. Despite Nintendo’s claim that all these third parties have their back, there isn’t much at all scheduled for release this year on the Switch thus far. You could peg it up to waiting for e3, or developers waiting for general momentum for the Switch. But how can a console gain momentum if no developers are putting games on it? It’d be mighty sad for the Switch to end up like the Wii U for a similar trickling library.
Scorpio just slayed the whole console market with a sharp ass knife
Lol no it didn’t. The Xbox will still have no games. Since when did hardware specs become the measurement of a console’s success? It is and always will be software lineup; Xbox will be dead last in exclusives by the end of this year.
PS4 was successful because of it’s power, but that’s only because Sony marketed it as the “Most Powerful Console On The Market” when really, it was miles behind modern tech but it was the most powerful for a time.
If Microsoft markets the Scorpio in the same manner, it could see some success amongst the player base who can’t afford switching to PC or just couldn’t be arsed getting a good PC.
“PS4 was successful because of it’s power,”
This is EXTREMELY untrue. No console ever has won a generation on the basis of being the most powerful, and suggesting that Microsoft pursue that route is asking them to fail.Granted, Microsoft has failed with every hardware release pretty hard already, so that’s probably going to happen no matter what.
This is confusing what gaming enthusiasts care about, with what the other 95% of the market care about.
In all fairness, Xbox 360 didn’t fail and outsold the PS3. Also, OG Xbox is one of most underrated consoles ever as essentially the Dreamcast 2. SEGA killed it with their Xbox exclusives.
What cronotose said is right. Sony didn’t win anything because of power. PS4 won because of good marketing, competitive pricing, and Microsoft’s epic launch/pre-launch blunder. The N64 was more powerful than the Saturn and PS1 (its cartridges obviously held it back). Heck, most 2D multiplats looked best on Saturn. Xbox and GameCube were also stronger than PS2, and had notably superior versions of multiplat games, yet the PS2 more than doubled the sales of both consoles combined. The Wii sold the most in its (admittedly close) generation despite being by far the weakest of the three. Power has never been correlated with sales. That’s a false illusion created by the Wii U’s failure, as it just so happened to be the weakest console. People seem to forget the horrible launch of the PS3, which was also the most powerful of its generation.
Having amazing specs probably didn’t hurt.
Of course not, and I didn’t say it did. It’s still never been historically correlated with sales.
Im talking about spec. When it comes to specs it blows the PS4 out of the water. But it has no exclusives that what kills it.
it might completed with the Nintendo Switch.
…. a $500 sharp ass knife, but without good exclusives.
Yeah what a waste of time and development
don’t get me wrong King, i have a Xbox One S, but to me, it is a waste to have a console so powerful and expensive for playing games that i can play in my xbox or switch.
The my PC just ripped it to pieces without even lifting a finger…. 16GB DDR4 RAM ma dude.
I completely forgot they were revealing that today. If it’s so sharp, Microsoft sure is keeping it in the drawer.
They need to hone the knife but they got no exclusives.
well they WOULD have one, but they thought it wasn’t going to be profitable and canned it. Way to pull a Konami.
Yeah. They really pulled a genius move, killing their most hyped game before launching a new console. Dumbasses!!!
#RIPScalebound
ps4 and Xbox where underpowered when they launched
Complete hogwash. “underpowered” in comparison to what? PC’s that cost 4x as much that play the exact same games at slightly higher resolutions?
The only sensible way to measure power is in comparison to the games that are going to be developed. The games that are going to be developed MUST be able to sell to a lot of people. Most people don’t buy high end gaming PC’s. As such, those high end PC’s are stuck playing ports of games made for those consoles you’re looking down on, paying dramatically more for a near identical experience. The consoles weren’t underpowered, you’re just buying far more machine than is practical. A 300 hp car isn’t underpowered just because 800 hp cars exist. 99.99999% of the time, that 800hp car is just a colossal waste of money.
http://s3-ak.buzzfeed.com/static/2014-07/8/17/enhanced/webdr02/anigif_enhanced-16991-1404854716-9.gif
to everyone who said its slightly more than the wiiu, devs are saying its closer to the ps4 and xbox1 but not more than, yet trolls make it sound like its the wii to the 360 and ps3
For ease of grasping the comparative differences, the best mechanism I’ve encountered is to assign numbers. Well, if the WiiU is “1”, and the XB1 is “100”, in what vicinity would the Switch be?
Well, first, we have to realize that the performance is different between undocked (handheld mode) Switch and docked (console mode) Switch. GPU clock runs at only 40% when undocked, and the RAM runs slower as well, though I don’t know the ratio. They both run at 100% when docked. CPU is the only constant so that logic isn’t interrupted. So in our “1-100” system of measure, we actually need two different numbers.
Undocked, I don’t believe it’s significantly more powerful than WiiU, maybe “10-20” in our 1-100 system – but it’s also a portable in that mode, and should be judged by portable standards. By those standards that is AMAZINGLY POWERFUL! Docked, things like Fast RMX, Snake Pass and Lego City paint a picture that is probably more in the ballpark of “70-80”. From the standards of a console, that’s not exactly amazing. However, it definitely makes it MUCH closer to XB1 capabilities than WiiU capabilities – so you are right!
It also means that in the final analysis, it’s not just an incremental bump over the WiiU we were afraid it would be, but a more or less “full-generational-leap” over Nintendo’s previous and system. And then finally, when we realize that the “hardware proper” of the Switch is an ARM-based system – a glorified Ubuntu tablet – and it still comes that close to x86-powered XB1 suddenly pushes the performance proposition back into the “AMAZINGLY POWERFUL” territory”!
So, my starting point for multiplatform from now on will be Switch, with PC if I need a more premium experience, completely leap-frogging the PS4/XB1’s offering. Between the Switch and PC, I think I’m pretty much done with buying multiplatform games on PS4 or XB1 – not powerful enough in light of the looming spectre of PC versions, while also being complete non-starters against the amazing flexibility of the Switch – and also not being far enough ahead of Switch in terms of power anyway.
Because of console exclusives, all the PS+/XBLG goodies, and then just the fact that I’m a competionist, i’ll never -willingly- get rid of the PS4/XB1. They’ll always have a place in my life. But as far as just the multiplatform games go…..thanks to the PC on the one hand, and the Switch on the other, the PS4 and XB1 are now pretty much dead to me.
Cheers!
I have no idea what you said, but you sound happy so yes! Cheers darling!!
Oh, and one last thing: don’t worry too much about all the Switch-hate on the internet. After all, what is the internet with people who so readily “prematurely ejaculate doom and gloom”.
…..Sometimes they end up getting a face full of it! :-)
Cheers!
*without
Being cute doesn’t make you right.
Just in case you weren’t aware. :D
But you keep doing you. :)
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/6e/5c/41/6e5c415ce020adff978e6e39c9d41e8d.jpg
Thank you, my sweet earth child. (Or dog?)
Just like being jaded doesn’t make you right. Just in case you weren’t aware. But you keep being “drybones”.
Credit where credit’s due, though – even if it’s a tremendously dubious honor I’m about to bestow: I am not sure I’ve ever encountered a more apt and fitting username to the person who owns it than what I’ve encountered in reading your posts, “Jaded Drybones”. That trophy is yours, mate!
well I’ll be darned
I just want developers to bring great content to the Switch… The graphics debate has been on life support since wii, ps3 and xbox360… Graphics are beautiful enough on all modern platforms
A hardware teardown and performance benchmarking has been done. It falls somewhere between a WiiU and XboxOne (which is, by the way, barely counts as “current gen” tech.)
The whole argument about how strong the switch is has been answered, and some dev saying, “Look how pretty Snake Pass is! Switch must be close to the PS4!” I’m sad it was Image and Form, because I really love those guys, but this was not their brightest moment. – When games are developed for the PS4 Pro and Scorpio, the switch will have the advantage of some solid, initial install-base numbers to counter the huge technology gap.
If you Ninnies buy what 3rd party is released for Switch, contrary to your actions on the WiiU, then I do think 3rd parties will cut, optimize and do what they can to port to the switch.
If you get all flustered because your switch version doesn’t get all the DLC or isnt quite as flushed out as a other systems that dwarfs the switch, then 3rd party will back off again, just like the WiiU.
The ball is partially in Switch owners hands. if they show there is a market for 3rd party games, and people keep buying the switch, then it could be a solid system to own. The WiiU sold amazing in its first few months and that ended in an epic failure.
||In the end, everything depends on High Command’s support in the battlefield…||
||If they continue to deliver new weaponry regularly, then it shall be a success and the end of the Xbot infection in Japan…||
It must cost more to ship those Xboxes to Japan than what they actually make. They are probably keeping their foot in the door for business reasons.
||The only business I see is the disrupting presence they have there for no reason at all other than to engage our armies…||
That sir isn’t why 3rd parties backed out of the Wii-U, you’re just talking out of your ass now. What killed the Wii-U was Nintendo’s decision at the time to not break away from their “kids first” ideals. Companies repeatedly hounded Nintendo for a paid online service for better support to their games (no one wants cheating and hacking in multiplayer.) They also wanted a console that was easier to develop for which the Wii-U was not. Nintendo’s unwillingness to give in and lack of promoting the Wii-U led to its demise. 3rd parties didn’t back off because of games not being bought or having the same dlc or because the wii-u wasn’t as powerful. They backed off because Nintendo wanted it done their way and they weren’t going to give in to Nintendo’s demands.
That Sir, was a damn good list of reasons. thanks for contributing.
While we’re making a conclusive list of reasons WiiU failed, let’s not forget Nintendo abandoning the system for almost 2 years. Did it launch with a Zelda, a game everyone HAD to play? No. It launched with NSMB rehash, followed by a drought.
There. I covered one of the big ones you missed.
Your turn. Let’s keep this going. I’m sure there are a couple more we haven’t thought of yet!
:)
You are both right, sadly. All of these things contributed to the Wii U being a total failure.
indeed and all that said I have come to enjoy my Wii U and have no plans to sell or trade it. :)
I’m good without a Wii U. The Switch might end up doing remasters like the PS4 is doing with a bunch of PS2 & PS3 games. I got a number of games from past PlayStations on my PS4 thanks to this. If it doesn’t… *shrug* Oh well.
“If you Ninnies buy what 3rd party is released for Switch, contrary to your actions on the WiiU, then I do think 3rd parties will cut, optimize and do what they can to port to the switch.
If you get all flustered because your switch version doesn’t get all the DLC or isnt quite as flushed out as a other systems that dwarfs the switch, then 3rd party will back off again, just like the WiiU”
These are contradictory statements. Which one is it? Buy third party games so that they’re optimized better with full content (meaning they’re buying poorly optimized, incomplete games just to get developers to do a better job), or third parties optimize them and provide full content so consumers buy them? Such a silly dichotomy, and that latter CLEARLY would lead to better sales, not the former. Not that I care, mind you. I find no joy in most multiplats.
Being a Nintendo fan IS living in controdiction.
Or are you new to the Nintendo fan base?
There really needs to be a Nintendo Rehab for those of us trying to quit. :)
||It’s amusing, once again we find ourselves at opposite sides of the same coin as you humans say…||
||You call it contradictory, I call it compromise…||
It’s all about how hard developers want to work on a Switch port and whether that extra effort will play out financially. There is no reason to say that a game “won’t run” on the Switch – devs might just be unwilling to lower the resolution, dial down the lighting effects, and compress textures.
There’s nothing about the vanilla XBO and PS4 specs that would mean a game could “run” on those platforms but not so on the Switch.
I would mostly agree. But you DO run into technical walls.
To those who think that power means success.
Ps2 was the weakest console of it’s generation. It’s the best selling console of all time.
The DS was weaker than either of Sony’s handhelds, yet it is the second best selling console of all time. The PS3 was outsold by the weaker Xbox 360 and that was outsold by the MUCH weaker Wii.
Power doesn’t sell consoles. Games do.
Dreamcast was technically the weakest of that generation. Poor thing is always forgotten. But the point still stands.
Yea it’s probly capable if devs are willing to spend the time and resources to optimize. So far most aren’t. It’s all about the demand, if there is none devs won’t care. Now if a game is really pushing graphics and power then I would understand but many AAA games don’t
This is what I’ve been saying all along! FastRMX, Snake Pass, and now Leto City Undercover have been implying I’ve been right, and now the Devs are corroborating it. So I’m feeling 0% percent surprise, 100% vindication! Good for me, right? :-)
I’ve been estimating that if the performance of the WiiU is represented by the number “1”, and XB1 is represented by the number “100”, the Switch when undocked (low-performance mode) is somewhere in the “10-20” area – which by the standards of a portable is INSANELY POWEFUL.
And when docked (full-performance mode) we could be expecting somewhere in the “70-80” range. That does put it behind the curve of current console standards a little bit, but not so far behind that it’ll fail at all to be able to “hang with the others” respectably well. Plus it still puts it at a more or less “full generational leap” over the outgoing WiiU, which is important to me!
Now, PS4 Pro and especially Scorpio will put it behind the curve even further, but all in all, the performance level is a REALLLLLLY smart balance for the system all things considered. I’m quite happy! And you never know, N may indeed look into making an active dock that does enhance the performance of the console even further, and that may keep it more competitive – although it will begin to introduce logic interruption concerns if additional CPU power is needed, and it will only make the storage problems even more worrisome then they already are. But where there’s a will, there’s generally a way.
My point is simply that we have a reasonably powerful device right now, and possibilities for future expansion DO exist….oh yeah, …and neener neener to the doomsayers. ;-)
I’ll follow this up with something a bit more “tl;dr”. :-)
I think that we’re missing the big picture here of why Snake Pass is an important example.
Snake Pass is both a good game and a bad game to use as comparison. As pretty as it is, it’s still a stylized colorful platformer that’s small in size, and you can’t ignore that. Games of this calibur only need graphics to be at a certain level. Compare the visuals between Mario Sunshine, Mario Galaxy, Mario 3D World, and Mario Odyssey – not too terribly different.
The big deal is that Nintendo’s created a handheld that CAN play some of the same demanding games as a PS4 or XB1, with some graphical tweaking. So some textures drop, we reduce draw distance, drop to 30FPS and drop resolution. It’s made a system that can, with some modification, port many current gen games.
Look at a PC game. They often have different graphical settings, for high-functioning PCs and lower PCs. To port a PC game to the XBox One, they need to further lower the demanding nature of the game. Now, to make a portable game, all they need to do is just reduce it a little bit further.
Compare this to ANY previous generation, when if you wanted a portable version of a game you essentially needed to create a brand-new game. Nintendo’s created a situation in which people can choose which is more important to them – better graphics, or more freedom and convenience.
I think that if Switch *really* takes off, then a lot of developers will invest a little bit of money just to get a portable version of their game and that much more revenue. But this will only happen if the Switch has a big audience that is interested in third party games. It’s simple economics.
I don’t disagree with anything you’re saying here, but there’s one thing I’d want to add:
Snake Pass looks “cute and kiddy”, yes, which will cause some people to write it off because it’s not, let’s say, Doom 2016. They’ll interpret that cuteness as a light, and low-demand game, and not a tremendously significant testimony to what the Switch is capable of, or what the future [likely] holds for the system, but dismiss it as “just a technically insignificant game” that doesn’t prove much.
However, I think that Snake Pass is actually tremendously more significant than this. I don’t know how much of this is optimization, and how much is the actual [to make up a word] “demandingness” of the game itself, but Snake Pass seems to be a tremendously substantial game based on the way it performs. Consider the PS4 version of Snake Pass vs the PS4 version of Doom: this big deal, high end, blockbuster Doom game – the kind of game that people are saying Switch couldn’t handle runs on PS4 at native 1080p (with dynamic scaling down to 900p under load), and stays pretty close to 60fps throughout. Now what about Snake Pass? 800-something-p (read: -LESS- than 900p) and only 30fps.
Now, as I said before, there are other possible explanations than just the technical heft of the game: it could be Snake Pass is poorly optimized / difficult to optimize for PS4, where I’ve heard Doom is so easy to optimize it could run on a Smart Fridge practically. Or, it could just be developer decisions to favor an absolutely perfect frame rate rather than something which jumps around a bit. But at a glance, at least, the picture painted by the PS4 version of Snake Pass is that it’s a tremendously heavy-duty, very demanding game that still manages to run quite respectably on the Switch. And as such, drastically raises the bar for what the system would be long-term capable of in my mind, and paints a much brighter future for the system than the doomsayers have been saying.
So yeah, Snake Pass is HUGE! It proves with the Switch that where there’s a will, there’s a way. And with as hot as things are selling, and as excited as people are for it, I think it’s an all but completely foregone conclusion that there will be a will. I didn’t have a chance to read the article yet, so there may be something I’m missing, but just going by the headline “Square Enix will be putting more focus into Switch than Scorpio”, I think we’re already starting to see it happen! :-)
The future’s bright! :-)
Cheers!
Follow-up to my previous comment:
Implications:
1) if they can figure out storage concerns, the Switch is powerful enough to be able to handle any game with only modest downgrades to accommodate the hardware. Meaning it’ll still look respectably good, still play good…..and best of all, be able to be taken on the go – a place none of the other consoles can go. So long as they can figure out the storage concerns, that is – it may end up taking a lot of swapping SD cards in and out.
2) the PS4 and XB1 versions of games will still be a little bit more premium experiences than the Switch version, yes. BUUUT a) you can’t take them on the go with you, which is HUUUUGE, and b) though the XB1 / PS4 are indeed more powerful than the Switch, and their versions of games will be a little bit more premier, as a PC gamer, the idea of PS4 and XB1 as performance propositions, as well as the quality levels of their ports vs the PC version of the game are….well….cute.
So, PS4/XB1 are only so much more powerful than the Switch, waaaaaaaaaaaayyyy less powerful than the PC and a -complete non-starter- against the flexibility and use case magic of the Switch.
In my opinion, then: were it not for the saving graces of the console exclusives, and the sheer magnitude of free/cheap stuff you get each month from PS+/XBLG, when held in the light of being a PC and Switch owner, there would be no value in or need for PS4 and XB1 at all! Like….none whatsoever!
HOWEVER: because of those exclusives and services, there will ALWAYS be value and merit in the two traditional consoles. Nintendo isn’t the only console exclusives game in town (though they do have the most well beloved, and arguably “the best” proprietary IPs and games out there), and PCs have virtually nothing in the way of exclusives (it’s just that anything they DO have, they do better than anything else does them). Also neither PC and ESPECIALLY NOT Switch have any services that come anywhere close to the free-stuff-giving virtues of PS+/XBLG.
So, while I have literally looked at my XB1 and PS4 and thought to myself “man, do a I even still need you guys anymore?”, at the end of the day, the answer to that question is ultimately “yeah, I suppose I still do”.
So yeah, I do have all four platforms, and have zero intentions to get rid of ANY of them! However, I will say two things:
1) let’s pretend calamity strikes and I have to go down from all four platforms to just two….the decision to get rid of the PS4 and XB1 would be an exceedingly painful one to execute upon……but yet, exceedingly easy to actually make. They’d be so gone, and I’d just be a PC and a Switch gamer.
2) Even though I do plan to keep the PS4/XB1, and even though I plan to keep buying and playing the consoles exclusives, as well as take max advantage of the Ps+/XBLG services, and even though I plan to continue to follow the inroads Windows 10 and UWP are making into XB1, as well as maybe looking into PSVR, there is in-fact at least one way in which the two traditional consoles are indeed “dead to me” now: and that’s as it concerns multi-platform games.
I mean that’s not to go so far as to say that I’ll literally NEVER have another multiplatform PS4/XB1 game. There may be instances where I receive one as a gift, or an instance where I find it for dirt cheap in a bargain bin, or it’s one of the free XBLG/PS+ games for the month, or I have a bunch of friends with a console version that are begging me to buy it so I can play with them…or maybe even just have a couple games on hand as “reference material” for the purposes of comparing to the Switch and/or PC version(s).
But beyond those circumstances? If a game that exists on PS4 and/or XB1 also exists on Switch and/or PC….then I will NEVER buy the PS4 or XB1 versions EVER AGAIN!! I will buy it on the Switch, or the PC, or both. The PS4/XB1 versions, in the context of the four really just don’t offer anything at all. If I need a more graphically intensive, premium version of a game than the Switch version, why would I waste my time with PS4/XB1 levels of performance when my PC output so dramatically humiliates them (and I’m not even rocking any kind of super insane PC build). They just don’t offer me anything that wouldn’t be BETTER offered by one or the other of the other two.
As such, I’m effectively done now with traditional console versions of the multiplats. XB1/PS4 will continue to exist for me now ONLY as boxes for console exclusive / free (or dirt cheap) stuff / and console special features, and that’s it. That’s what kind of game changer the PC, and ESPECIALLY the Switch are!
Cheers!
this is a sad article we have reached SATURATION POINT IN GRAPHICS thee is no graphics war everything runs these engines and abillitys now
it can run any game a dv team make for it
scopio EXCUSE ME BUT THE GIENT BOX LOCKE UNDER THE TV IS OBSOLETE TECH FACT PS4 PRO AGQAIN A LOCKED UNDER THE TV BOX IS OBSOLETE
AND EXCUSE ME WERE3 IS SCOPIOS CONTROLLER INNOVATION WERE IS THE Advanced gyro were is the hands apart controls
were is the hd reumble SHALL I GO ON
THERES ONE GEN 9 CONSOLE IN EXISTENCE ITS CALLED SWITCH….I PUT MY MONEY WERE MY MOUTH IS IN NINTENDO STOCK
THE EXCT SAME GAMES IN A HIGHER RES AND WITH OUTDATDED UN INVENTIVE CONTROLS
AND LOL IF IT COMES WITH A old ass spinning disc drive SPINNING DISCS IN 2017 ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME
Using snake pass as an example isn’t fooling anyone but fanboys. When aaa third party games also come out for the switch, only then will I be convinced once and for all. Good luck to the switch.
shut up
Make an argument. Don’t just tell people to shut up like a child.
I think he literally is a child lol
Oh lol
I didn’t say anything.
That’s both a lie and part of the problem.
Why?
awww, someone sad the switch isn’t a flop? <:3
99% fanboy says what?
So, a room full of devs say the Switch is a pretty powerful little machine…..but some guy in a comments section says it’s not…..
…..who to believe? Who to believe?
Yes. One little development team, an indie one at that, says this. When Square Enix or even Rockstar Games says this, then you can tote their word all the way to the bank. But an indie dev? That’s like the guy who created The Letter, who was also an indie dev, telling you the Switch is this powerful juggernaut & actually believing him. You’d be a fool to. But what do I know. I’m just some guy in the comments section, right? This entire mindset of “You have to have experience to judge something!” is just down right fucking stupid. It’s like telling someone they can’t judge the taste of bread because they don’t know how to make it. I got my eyes & I got common sense. I don’t need experience to know an indie dev (amateurs) is not the same as a triple A developer (professionals.)
I never once said that the laity knows nothing, or can say nothing. You’re putting words in my mouth and frankly – you need to knock it off. I mean, I talk tech myself. Look at all my tl;drs up in here on My Nintendo News. I also wrote in 2012 an 8-part series totaling about 60 pages on the 16-bit console wars which focused on hardware in an online video game magazine. It wasn’t a professional thing, and I’m no professional. So I certainly am not saying that we all just need to shut our mouths and let the elders speak.
Instead what I’m saying is that I’ve got someone in the industry (more than one person actually, I’ve got other sources as well) telling me one thing, and then I’ve got you (and me) someone in a comments section telling me something else. His word carries a lot more weight is all I’m saying. Not as much as a big studio, for sure. You’re actually right on that point. But this actually augments my point in a way as it establishes a sort of “hierarchy of credibility” thing, in which, you and I, the comments section dwellers, really only slot higher than the old folk’s home, the kindergarten class, and the cheese monger at the supermarket, and quite a bit less than the people, you know, actually making games for the damned thing, and actually interacting with the hardware at he nuts and bolts level. I mean, unless you’re up to something you’re not telling me. Otherwise, I stand by my previous post.
Meanwhile, by all means, keep all those words coming out of your mouth*, it’s the democracy of the internet – but stop putting them in others’ – like NOW!
*= speaking of words coming out of your mouth, in having read many of your comments, I’ve began to wonder if you’re even capable of sharing a phone number without resorting to the F-word. It’s a bit of a calling card of yours, it seems.
Cheers!
Sure are relying on the wishful thinking of others a lot, huh. *shrug* Oh well. Not like I’m the one that’s gonna get hugely let down for believing a bunch of people only calling the Switch powerful because of their experience with little indie games as if their games are even in the same league as big triple A games like Horizon or Resident Evil 7.
It’s sad everyone in love with their Switch are so desperate to believe just one development team, and an indie one at that, when a previous article has already shown tech wise that the Switch is not even on the same exact level as the Xbox One or even the PS4. Of course, it is always possible this dev knows something about the Switch that the ones that found this out about the Switch’s inner tech don’t know. But the dev does not even hint at that being a possibility, either. Just people scratching the bottom of the barrel in the hopes they can actually break through the bottom & find some magical portal that gives them more than the empty barrel contained.
||That’s why the pawns need leaders…||
And I, on the other hand, think it’s so very sad that people are wasting so much of their lives loudly (and oft times profanely) kvetching about something they’re so sure is so doomed and such a waste of time and such a piece of garbage in online comments sections.
I mean, if the Switch is a waste of time, what does that make investing time into it, hmmm? Is it a need to be listened to – to be paid attention to? Is it a need to seem smarter and wiser than even an indie developer who’s at least gotten his hands dirty inside something other than his own bum? What is it with this need to invest so much personal energy into a non-starter when its fate has [supposedly] already been sealed? It all just seems so very desperately “mommy’s basement” – I’m sorry, where are my manners, you are a king after all – [ahem] so very “Queen Mother’s dungeon”.
Now, it’s freely granted on my part that I myself only partially escape my own critique here: I spend way too much time on these things as well, and there is a part of me that likes to have a voice, and hope that others enjoy and benefit from that voice. I do a podcast for crying out loud (although, ironically, there’s very little talking on my part in this current program of my podcast). So I have to point the finger back at myself in all these ways….
…..but here’s perhaps the million dollar distinctive, Kalas: I’m spending my time defending and championing something I believe in, and something I think is not only NOT a waste of time and the final damning of a once great name, but the thing that will revolutionize gaming and redeem said name. I mean, even already in such a short time, between a gaming PC much more powerful than the consoles, and then this amazing little Switch thing that completely tears down long-standing video game paradigms (and until proven otherwise I am regarding as close enough in power to the consoles to not make it a huge liability), my view on the two traditional consoles has changed radically, and not in a way that would probably be considered favorable (though I do at least stop a bit short of telling everyone to just get rid of them as no longer necessary – the console exclusives alone will keep them necessary).
And then we have a comments section overrun with people ranging from outright trolls to just people who so readily and eagerly “prematurely ejaculate” doom and gloom all over everything – “doom spoojers” is what I call you lot, and several of you make quite the cartoons of yourselves.
I mean, if I held your bleak and fatalistic view of the Switch and of Nintendo, do you know what I’d do? I’d go cook dinner, walk the dog, watch Netflix, play Sega, take a soak bath, chase my dreams of being an Oppereto (okay, not that last one), paint the house….anything, ANYTHING other than waste my short existence on message boards and comments sections dedicated to something that’s such a waste of time, and a still-born outfit. It’s pathetic! If this thing has no life, at least you can have one, friend. So why don’t you?
I know your paragraph long user name does express a desire to be convinced, and I won’t pretend to know your heart, but what I’ve observed in the wild seems pretty indicative of a mind that’s pretty thoroughly made up already. Though you may certainly tell me otherwise if I’m somehow misreading you.
Now, final point: as one who believes in free speech for all, it forces me to “positionally” support the rights of expression for many things that I done support – even things that I think range from the ridiculous to the deplorable, so please do not think I’m trying to tell you you have no right to be here and don’t have the right to express yourself. If you revel in the “Queen Mother’s dungeon life”, who am I to stop you? I simply wanted to turn the lights on in that dungeon for you so that if you didn’t realize that’s where you were you now did, and could consider if that’s where you wanted to stay. I mean, think about it: let’s be practical here: each second spent spoojing all over this place is one less second you can spend with your Plaaaaaaaaaaaaaaystation! [fanfare!]
Cheers!
Talk about getting hugely misread. You think I’m talking like this because I’m part of some group of doomsayers for Nintendo. No. I’m talking like this because I’m a Nintendo fan that has freed himself from the shackles & blinders he let Nintendo put on him in the previous gens leading up to the Switch from the N64’s need to stick with cartridges when everyone was moving to discs that were able to contain a lot more data than cartridges back then to the GCN using small discs instead of normal discs for DVD & using a DVD/CD player to the Wii pushing motion controls instead of doing motion controls, which I saw great potential in, AND HD but got lucky because millions & millions of casuals were lured in by games the rest of us laughed at as being shovelware for grandma & exercise nuts to the Wii U barely, if any at all, getting any marketing while continuing the trend of not adding things that made the other consoles great while focusing on another gimmick, one I enjoyed mind you as a second screen has been the best thing to happen to handhelds so why wouldn’t I expect it do the same for home consoles, with no universal account system so I had to deal with another instance of losing progress in a lot of games all because Nintendo were fucking idiots & thought console locked shit, which the Wii had a little issue with when it came to online games like Endless Ocean or The Last Story, was a good thing out of some blind attempt to stop hacking which didn’t stop it at all & merely punished people like me. Do I hate the Switch? A tiny bit, yes, since it’s continuing the trend that made all the previous consoles, before N64, a bit of a joke that turned Nintendo itself into a joke, but I still have one for the same reason you do I imagine. At the same time, I’m not so stupid as to put all of my trust & faith in Nintendo again because I’ve realized they’ve let me down countless times before. All it takes is one wrong move from Nintendo to bury the Switch & I refuse to be in the rubble again picking up the pieces when that happens because I kept a positive outlook 24/7 like a dumb Nintendo sheep/fanboy in the past. I’ve done it enough with Nintendo & all I get is broken promises & games that could have been way better than what they ended up being. Or I barely got any games at all because, before the Switch, they did everything in their power to push triple A 3rd parties away out of fear the competition they created might actually beat their 1st party titles on their system because they had this ego & thought they didn’t need 3rd parties to sell well on their systems to stay afloat. (For that, I actually thank the Wii U for being a failure & thank Nintendo for fucking it all up because it broke the ego a bit & made them realize they do need 3rd parties to sell well on their systems.) So til a big triple A company comes & says this or that, fuck what the indies, or their supporters, say. Their word about power is meaningless when they don’t even push the most data heavy games. I’m not so desperate, or a Nintendo fanboy anymore, to jump on every positive news I hear in some vain attempt to pretend Nintendo is 100% gonna rise with the Switch. As I said, just one wrong move is all it takes to destroy every bit of good the Switch might have already accomplished. I’m keeping myself distant til E3 in the hopes it might blow me out of the water with Switch. If I get in the same mindset as the rest of you & hope for the very best, I’m just gonna get hugely letdown again by Nintendo if you all end up very, very wrong. I suggest you all do the same & curve your hope a bit or else you could very well one day end up. Exactly. Like. Me! Too much faith & hope in a company can really fuck you up when you realize they just aren’t as great as they use to be. Anyway, like I said toward your other comment toward me, I won’t be left broken, anymore than I already am which I made obvious in this, essentially, rant, & in the dust again when these indie guys & wishful thinkers end up deadly wrong & the Switch falls flat on it’s face, crushing every bit of hype & hope it built up for a lot of you because you listened to indie devs for some reason. Good luck because you people are seriously gonna need it with the current Nintendo if nothing has really changed from past consoles. (Paragraph of a name? My name ain’t THAT long. Paragraphs at least need to be 3 lines long & my name is only 1 line & a half long. *shrug*)
And I got called a PlayStation fanboy again. lol If I was one of those, I’d be like that thanos guy calling Nintendo & their fans gay losers. (Gay as an insult these days is soooo 90s!) *realizes it* And I was getting called a basement dweller all because I’m not blindly following Nintendo & accused of being a PS fanboy. Honestly, I wish I did have an awesome man-cave that I could have all the lights off in. I do like to enjoy all of my games, movies, & television shows in complete darkness. GLARES ON MY SCREENS ARE MY MORTAL ENEMY & THEY WILL BE ANNIHILATED!!! *moves hands weirdly & fades back into the darkness of the dungeon I sadly DON’T have*
Well, I didn’t EXACTLY call you a PS fanboy. Although it does seem like the people who are most critical of the Switch just so happen to also be among the most complimentary of the PS4.
Now, I simply wanted to apologize for having not gotten back to you sooner. Between family plans, a sick kiddo, putting work into my podcast, and yeah, getting sucked back into BotW…..AGAIN….I just haven’t had the time to craft a response that deals with all of what you had to say. Perhaps we’ve both in our own turns misread each other to some extent, and you certainly have said some things that warrant a serious response. Above all, it seems like there’s at least a bit of a road forward for us in our dialog.
So hopefully I’ll have a chance to get back to you tomorrow. Tomorrow will probably also be a big day of more podcast work, but I shouldn’t have too much trouble carving out some time…..that is….unless that damned Switch doesn’t completely derail my day…..like has happened waaaaaaaaaaaayyyy too much lately! ;-)
Til then.
Cheers, Kalas!….or whatever your real name is…..I’m John, by the way.
Guys you have to understand what it’s been written. It means that it can get ports but it’s obvious that they will be severely lacking (at least for those AAA games).
It’s CLEAR that it’s more similar of a Wii U than an Xbox One. And every game showed that kind of detail.
It can get ports with half framerate, lower resolution, lower texture definition, etc. That’s it.
The real pro of the console is that support Unreal Engine 4 and Unity 5.6. That will greatly help ‘watered-down’ portings.
Why don’t you just focus on the true pros of the console?
1. Nintendo games.
2. Portability (and TV mode, it’s a home console too).
3. Motion controls.
4. Easy to develop for (and to get ports).
5. Boosted Wii U graphics (because Wii U isn’t awful, it’s still so good graphics wise).
6. Fast resume, fast pause. Excellent OS.
7. Online less costly.
8. No need to install games and durable cartridges.
9. Joy-Con (most versatile controller ever).
Why continue to hope on false dreams.
It isn’t in the same league of the other two power wise, but those are obsolete in every other department.
SWITCH IS THE ONLY GEN 9 SYSTEM IN EXISTENCE IT HAS NO COMPETITION THAT IS INDUSTRY FACT TECH FACT AND PLAIN ASS REALITY
switch can do unlimited things due to it form factor NO AMOUNT OF FLOPS WILL ALLOW ME TO CONTROL A WHOLE SOCCER TEAM IN REAL TIME LIKE PES WII ONLY CONTROLLER INNOVATION WILL DO THAT
no amount of flops will allow me to dual weapons fire in a fps game only joycons dual 3d gyro mouse will allow that
no amount of flops will allow me to take my console ANYWHERE and play on and off line
no amount of flops will allow me to use a touch screen
no amount of flops will allow me full fedback in game like hd rumble
THAT IS THE FACT OF THE MATTER NOT THE OPINION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I disagree with two of your points but that’s not enough for me to disagree with the overall point of the post. I don’t get how the same people who can say that hardware doesn’t matter will constantly try to claim the difference in performance between the Switch and XBO or even PS4 is minimal.
Though it isn’t that high like a new generation. With a new generation a 10x jump is expected to make the games looks really different. Here it’s more a 3/4x difference and it has just 2x the RAM. PS2 got 16x the RAM of PSX and PS3 16x the RAM of PS2. The Nintendo Switch has just half the RAM of the PS4. All considered it isn’t a generation jump and that’s good (more than what expected considering it’s portable).
It’s not the RAM amount that’s the real difference, it’s the RAM speed. There’s a nearly 7x difference in bandwidth between the Switch and PS4 and about an 8x difference between the Switch and XBO.
The RAM amount is something I have a little less of an issue with since Switch games should use less anyway since they have lower polygon counts, perhaps lower-resolution textures that can be ASTC compressed, etc.
Of course, it’s not like the Switch would have made use of 8GB of RAM if it had it since they could have fit something like Mario Kart 8 completely in RAM and had no load times.
RAM size is more important, you can reduce resolution and definition of the textures but can’t reduce the ‘core’ of the game. Bandwidth is important too but more for graphics, and graphics can be tuned down to consume less bandwidth. With all the memory optimizations in place it’s like having a GT640 with comparable bandwidth and general power (you can run GTA V on a GT640, 720p High setting or 1080p Normal setting, 720p looks better overall in my opinion).
I may or may note disagree. It depends what you count as the core of the game. If you mean game logic then that doesn’t generally use up that much memory. For example, Killzone Shadowfall only used about 6 MB of memory for actual game logic. I’m sure something like Breath of the Wild used more since physics of integral to it’s gameplay experience and its open world so it needs to stream stuff streaming is kind of a function of everything, not just memory footprint. For example, the amount of streaming that can be done is more dependent on storage speeds, the amount that needs to done is dependent on the amount of memory available, what that memory can hold is dependent on the size of things like textures and geometry and resolution, and how much of what’s in RAM is actually drawn or can be interacted with is dependent on the GPU, CPU, memory bandwidth, and resolution..
So the reason I think that bandwidth is more important here is because of scalability problems that I mentioned in previous arguments but also because a game like Breath of the Wild can do all that it does with 1 GB of RAM on the Wii U and the Switch not only has more memory but can make even better use of that memory with it’s texture and frame buffer compression. So if there’s one area where the Switch is particularly well equipped, it’s the amount of memory it has.
I mean all the data going in the System RAM in a PC for example. There are parts of the game that can’t be reduced (or the developer don’t want to be reduced). 3GB available for games isn’t that much (though it’s 3x the Wii U and 6x the PS3). Nintendo already said they included more things in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe thanks to the availability of more RAM (double item mechanic). I suppose other developers can have more higher RAM requirements than Nintendo.
I remember when talking with programmers they always said ‘I want more RAM’, and when talking about the original Xbox they always focused on the size of the RAM more than anything else. RAM size ease development, especially when porting resource heavy games. You can always cut graphics, even ‘content’ (different form graphics) but content requires a higher level of opitimizations.
Example, back in the days developers put 6 actors on one console and 4 in the other, 2 were cutted out because of insufficient RAM. Everything inside a game means a cost. Logic, AI, physics, audio, etc. the things that are not GPU bound. And everygames has its own specific requirements. Even a classic like Civilization IV used tons of RAM with the right Mod.
PC’s have seperate pools of RAM for the CPU and GPU with the GPU usually having a fraction of the amount the CPU so many games store assetts (textures, geometry, etc.) in system RAM in order to quickly stream them to the GPU when needed. The result is that there tends to be duplicate info in both pools of RAM with a decent amount of the info being used like a disc cache.
I do know that developer in the PS2, GCN, and Xbox era did feel that they were low on memory and that sentiment continued on the PS3 and X360 when devs weren’t even able to use all of the 512MB they consoles had. That’s the reason why PS4 and XBO gave devs about 5.5GB and I really haven’t heard of any developers making the same complaints. I’m assuming that’s very comparable to how much RAM is used in many PC games.
Those games however, look significantly better than Switch games and have significantly higher polygon counts, larger textures, and greater amount textures. Switch games, by comparison, are closer to PS3/X360/Wii U games but with 3-6 times more RAM available to them and with better compression available to them.
I don’t think the additional RAM was the reason that Mario Kart 8 Deluxe has two items slots. That’s a feature that requires minimal additional memory. All the items and item icons need to be in memory anyway and having two items associated with a racer on the track is just a matter of linking attaching another item to the racer in memory. We’re talking bytes of additional memory to add the additional property to a racer object in memory and a little more for the changes to add the second slot in the UI.
I’ve heard the example you mentioned before about some consoles having 4 when other had 6 but did they specically say it was because of insuffienct amount of RAM? Because having more racers on screen would also increase needed CPU and GPU memory bandwidth and if they RAM’s speed is insufficient, that would cause slowdowns.
I mean obviously both are important but I just believe that the Switch should have enough memory to meet the demands of the games that come out for it.
Yes, 4GB (3 GB available if I’m correct) is pretty good on the Nintendo Switch.
It’s the word of the developer: ‘Yabuki says the extra ram allowed his team to experiment with holding multiple items at once (all 12 characters including COM can hold 2 items at a time)’.
They always lamented RAM size, always said they could include more content with more RAM, and specifically talked about actors that time but I suppose it can be everything (persistance of dead corpses, items, etc.). there are many things that a typical player don’t take into account but they are there and occupy space.
RAM speed is always pretty good, there were few consoles limited by it (only the N64 comes to my mind). They are pretty tailored. It’s not like with a PC where the gamer always move up that anti-aliasing filter. On consoles they can optimizes everything. Though the limited amount of RAM (size) on the PS2 limited it by much.
Definitely I think the Nintendo Switch has enough RAM for everything. And bandwidth too, everything has been tailored out by nVidia to be balanced. Of course the more the better.
Guys, the Switch is about a fourth as capable as the PS4 regardless of what this guy is saying.
The AMD GPU most similar to the one in the PS4 is the HD7850 and the Maxwell GPU that is closest to it’s performance is the GTX 950.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=26938090&os1=Windows&api1=dx&hwtype1=dGPU&hwname1=NVIDIA+GeForce+GTX+950&did2=4679&os2=Windows&api2=dx&hwtype2=dGPU&hwname2=AMD+Radeon+HD+7850
The GTX 950 has 3 times as many cores as the Switch (2 GPCs each with 3 SMMs vs 1 GPC with 3SMMs), is clocked atleast 33% higher (1024Mhz vs 768Mhz), and has 4x more memory bandwidth (106 GB/s vs 25.6GB/s).
If we compare the TX1 and the HD7850 directly we get a performance difference of 3.9x.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=4679&os1=Windows&api1=dx&hwtype1=dGPU&hwname1=AMD+Radeon+HD+7850&D2=NVIDIA+Shield+Android+TV
You guys don’t make a good case for yourselves when you simultaneously say hardware doesn’t matter than constantly overhype the specs of the system you’re supporting.
RIIIIGGGHHHHTTTTT
Go be dumb somewhere else, Bowler.
YOU DONY COMPARE A 2012 GPU DIRECTLY TO A 2016 GPU ON A RAW FLOP NUMBER
WITCH SUPPORTS 8 TO 1 PIXEL COMPRESSION A END TO END FULL MEMORY GRAPHICSA DATA COMPRESSION SYSTEM AND FP16 SHADERS
ARE YOU A MORON
He seriously needs to take the meds he is so obviously supposed to be taking.
YOU DONT COMAPRE A 28NM SYSTEM WITH A 2012 GPU DIRECTLY TO A 2016 SOC WITH A 2015/16 GPU ON FLOP NUMBERS YOU IDIOT
YOUR IGNORING NEWER DESIGN YOUR IGNORING FP16 SHADERS YOUR IGNORING CUSTOM END TO END MEMORY COMPRESSION YOUR IGNORING 8TO1 PIXEL COMPRESSION
YOUR IGFNORING 20NM SOC EFFICIENCY
ARE YOU A FUCKING IDIOT
Hey, dumbass. I was comparing actual benchmarks between hardware not FLOP numbers. Those Shield TV benchmarks are factoring in every single one of those things already. In fact, the Shield TV numbers may be over representing what the Switch can do because TX1 in the Shield TV has a GPU clocked 30% higher and CPU clocked nearly twice as high.
Not once in my post did I ever mention FLOPS as they only measure as systems peak THEORETICAL performance. What I DID do was compare core counts, clock speeds, and memory bandwidth on two Maxwell chips which is an apples to apples comparison. Sure the TX1 has double speed FP16 support but that would mainly be beneficial to fragment shaders and it doesn’t apply to all instructions at all times nor does it double it’s memory bandwidth.
As for the added efficiency that 20nm has over 28nm, well that’s irrelevant because I wasn’t talking about power draw was I?
So the devs are saying the Switch is pretty close to the PS4/XB1 but we got a few guys in a comments section somewhere section saying it’s not….
…..who to believe? Who to believe?!
Us. Developers aren’t uniquely capable of figuring out how hardware compares on a higher level. Any body who looks up anything about the CPU and GPU in the Tegra X1 and uses the information available to them can tell that the Switch isn’t almost as powerful as the XBO or PS4. If a developer speaks to some low-level bits of the CPU or GPU where it’s better equipped than the other systems then that’s not something I can argu with them on, but there’s no intricacies about the Switch’s SoC that are going to come anywhere near bridging the gap between it’s specs and those of the dedicated home consoles.
I provided numbers and explained how it’s no where close to as powerful. It’s stupid to go “Just look at Snakepass on the Switch vs the PS4” and determine that it’s nearly on-par with the PS4 when I could just as easily go “Just look at BotW or Mario Kart 8 on the Switch vs the Wii U” and say it’s barely better than the Wii U. Differences in specs effect different games in different ways. In the case of Snakepass, it resulted in less shallow bokeh, removed water caustics and ripple and 60% lower resolution. In DragonQuest Heroes, it results in a framerate during battles that are a third the performance of the PS4 version while essentially inheriting the models, textures, and lighting from the PS3 version of the game.
In my dealings with the hardware of the 4th generation of gaming (aka the 16-bit console wars), one lesson that has become painfully apparent to me is that while spec sheets can’t outright lie, they can be just as deceiving in telling the truth as if they were.
Now, numbers are numbers, and I sure as hell am not suggesting they don’t mean anything. However, reading them at face value without the proper technical hermeneutic can be decidedly dangerous, and so someone just throwing numbers around in a comments section is virtually never an “end of discussion” matter – particularly among the laity found in comments sections. Interesting, no doubt, and not even a waste of time, necessarily as I myself do it when speaking about 4th gen gaming – but lacking a certain “incontrovertible authority”.
Now, in speaking with more than one professional in the tech industry, as well as just the simple ability to observe what we’re seeing with my own eyes, and compare it to trends we found in the launch window of the PS4/XB1, not only am what I’m being confidently told is to consider the Switch – when docked – to be in the ballpark of “70 to 80” if we consider WiiU as “1” and XB1 as “100”, but it is also what I am personally observing in my own experiences with the system. And I’m saying this as one who has a WiiU, a Switch, a PS4 (non-pro), an XB1, and a gaming PC powerful enough to have luck running several games in 4K at max everything, and not falling too far below 60fps – as well as about 35-40 other systems spanning the history of games – including the 4th gen systems of which I’ve written a series of articles myself dealing with their hardware. So I’m not only using it, I’m also able to use in in contrast to all these others.
Now, I’ve read the lion’s share of your comments, and as such, I will not discrace you by accusing you of not being a Nintendo fan, nor of being “a Switch hater”…..but no, I’m absolutely not persuaded in the least by your arguments, nor your legion of numbers.
Again, we have a COMPLETE AMATEUR spending – just like I am (so I’m not judging you here) – waaaaaaaaayyy too much of his time – his life, really – in the comments section of a blog that only gives us paragraph-long articles, and yet, I’m -REAAAAAALLLLYYY- supposed to believe you, YOU, over professional game developers and professional tech writers?
I think that’s an incredibly tall ask, my friend, like, tall on the order of the “LOL” not just being an internet colloquialism.
You know what? If, -IF- you are right here, sir, nothing you say will prove that or vindicate you in my eyes in the moment. Instead, you know what will? Time. Time, as we watch the unfolding of the system and its library, and the tech we see springing forth from it (or not). Whether the INCREDIBLY optimistic narrative that is unfolding before my eyes is able to be sustained over the long term, or whether the system hits a really low glass ceiling and it all falls flat.
I’m not so naive, nor blindly committed to my view, that I refuse to recognize that time may prove me wrong. Until then, I’m hanging confident in the “’70-80′ while docked” narrative (it’s certainly lower than that undocked, granted), and it will be the “gospel” that I continue to “preach”.
If I end up having to eat crow…..dinner will be ready in a couple years. Meanwhile, if you are the one who ends up staring at that plate of crow, I hope to be there offering you the complimentary glass of wine. :-)
Cheers, mate!
Now, one area where you and I may perhaps come a little bit closer to harmony is in the matter of what we think of the traditional consoles – what kind of value we see in them, and what kind of place we envision for them in the gaming world, and in our own lives.
My position on the matter is that because of a) the PS4/XB1 exclusive titles, and b) the unrivaled-in-the-industry free goodies distribution merits of XBLG/PS+, these alone justify the continued existence, and continued value, or merit of the two traditional consoles in our tech scene today. Supplementally, between my interest in following the inroads on XB1 with Windows 10, UWP, and the possible places that could all go – as well as being my Blu-Ray player – and the prospect of Sony exclusives in VR with PSVR, I don’t ever envision a day where there isn’t a place in my life and in my heart for the two.
HOWEVER, between the sheer power of the PC relative to the consoles – and the sheer flexibility of the Switch, I feel that outside the afore-mentioned benefits, the collective tag-team of PC/Switch renders the two consoles as [OTHERWISE] completely worthless…..like, no value at all! The current consoles are so far behind PC performance that the PC renders them…..well…..cute. And in addition to only being so much more powerful than the amazing little Switch, sorta softening that benefit, they are also complete non-starters against its use cases and sheerly revolutionary paradigm. I mean, in such an environment, with such competition, outside of the exclusives, and free goodies, what do they really even have to offer us anymore? You can’t really stand on power with them because of the ever looming specter of the PC, and you can’t really stand on convenience either, when you slip the Switch in your back pocket and head out the door.
So, I’ll say this: as I said above, the consoles will always have a place in my life, and in my heart – and in the industry as a whole. Indeed, if one were only going to have just one platform to game on, like one – period, then the traditional consoles might even be THE BEST all around option out there because of the great cross-swath of the gaming world they offer – all in a neat, tidy, intuitive, generally affordable package. But there is at least one sense in which the traditional consoles are, in fact, “dead to me” now: and that’s as it concerns Multiplatform games also available on the PC and/or the Switch.
I may get one as a gift, or in a huge discount in a bargain bin, or as a free XBLG/PS+ game of the month, or because I have a lot of friends playing the game on a console and they’re begging me to join in….or even just to have a small handful of them as “reference material” in order to be able to compare them against the Switch and/or PC version(s) of the game. So I’m certainly not going quite so far as to say I’ll NEVER add another multiplatform game to my console libraries. But outside of those reasons listed above, yeah, I’m totally done buying any game on PS4/XB1 that also exists on PC and/or Switch.
My starting point for multi-platforms moving forward will be the Switch, when applicable, and if I require a more premium version of the game than that, then why waste my time on PS4/XB1 half-measures when the PC port is soooooooooo much more impressive? And in the right context, I may just have to get both the PC -AND- the Switch versions….still no PS4/XB1.
Also, though I have no intentions to ever get rid of my PS4/XB1, should I face financial crisis and have no choice but to get rid of two out of the four….though the actual act of doing so would be quite painful and exceedingly difficult, at least the decision itself of which two would go, and which two would stay would be mercifully easy – I’d be saying goodbye to the PS4/XB1. I’d keep my PC, and I’d keep my Switch – the “left fist / right fist” one-two tag team duo of ULTIMATE GAMING!
In conclusion, I guess I feel that the position that says “screw PS4/XB1”, or that they are systems of a bygone era with no value for us today is wrong in the fashion of “Papa Bear’s Bed” – too hard. However, I also feel that the position that doesn’t see the collective supremacy of the PC and the Switch and all they offer us is also wrong – in the fashion of “Mama Bear’s Bed” – too soft. And yes, I say that as one who is striving to land at “Baby Bear’s Bed” – juuuuuuuust right! :-)
Cheers!
Damn. That was really well-worded my friend. Like I’m not even being sarcastic here, that was just incredibly effective.
And I feel I should explain why I said what I said because it is DOES sound very arrogant on my part. I just felt kind of driven to that because of how many people have acted like the Switch was some kind of battery powered PS4.
Despite my own use of saying the Switch is 1/4th the power of the PS4. I tend to not like talking about hardware in that way. For example, I don’t even like saying that the PS4 is 50% more powerful than the XBO is due to differences in CPU performs as well as the bandwidth available to them. The only reason I was okay with doing that in my last post is because that’s what those benchmarks show.
Back in the fourth generation and even into the sixth generation, video game consoles were very unique from each other and they required that a developer know how to write games that run bare metal. Once the seventh generation hit, being familiar with the hardware was still important to get the most out of a system especially the PS3 and that caused even large game developers to move to licensing third-party engines like Unreal Engine and by the time the 8th generation started, more third-party engines advanced and more were created and it’s now at the point where there are people making games who don’t know how to code. I’m friends with two people (who don’t know each other) who are game developers and both are game development teachers, too. They both know how to code, at least to some degree, but much of what they teach is How to Use Unity3D or How to Use Unreal Engine. Now that’s fantastic that development has become so user-friendly that even one person can put a game together but it also means that having the title of “game developer” no longer immediately means that someone has intimate knowledge of hardware or even knows what an instruction set is. Clearly, if someone was a programmer on the Uncharted games or Breath of the Wild or something very technically impressive, then they’re clearly very knowledgeable. When I see SteamWorld Dig developer saying this like “Oh yea, it’s clearly almost as powerful as a PS4, just look at these two games.” that , to me, paints a picture of the kind of developer whose good at making games but is less familiar with the intimate details of the hardware than people would think.
The reason I feel so sure about what the Switch is capable of is because it uses an off-the-shelf SoC that not only runs a more-or-less scaled down configuration of their desktop parts but is one that Nvidia themselves has ported games to with their own product, the Shield TV. I would say that, if anybody knows about the intricacies of the Tegra X1, it would be Nvidia and when they ported Tomb Raider (2013) to the Shield TV and there’s immediately noticeable improvements in image quality from the 360 version, not even resolution. Meanwhile you can find footage of both the GTX 950 and the HD7850 playing that same game at 1080p with noticeable increases in lighting, geometry, and textures settings. I think that’s telling.
So I take back my very un-nuanced answer that people should listen to people in comments sections but I stand by the opinion about what the Switch is capable off and if I eat crow for the opinion in the future, then I will eat crow and will embrace the learning experience. I’ll pass on the wine though lol I don’t drink. I’d prefer some fruit juice lol
On to your second post, I love that there are still people who see their are still benefits that the traditional console has. I do agree that the benefits of the PS4 and XBO, outside of exclusives which are becoming increasingly less of a thing on the XBO, are slim especially when someone has a decent PC. However, in that view point, doesn’t that make the Switch’s docked mode unnecessary? Wouldn’t a cheaper, smaller, dedicated handheld be more welcome in that case?
I’m not going to knock the fact that people like the concept of the Switch. What I’m disappointed by is that Nintendo made it and seemingly placed it as a successor to both their handheld and home console lines. What I mean by that is that, as someone who likes the Wii, Wii U, 3DS, DS, I thought they did what they did very effectively and while neither used chips that were anywhere near cutting edge for their time, they offered something unique in how you can play games with them and really took advantage of their form factors.
The 3DS was a handheld system made for a single player whose on the go and it’s dual screen, clamshell design was perfect for that. The clamshell protected the screens and made putting it to sleep really simple. Having dual screens allowed the touch screen be placed between the controls where it was easier to reach. Since it wasn’t used as a primary gameplay screen, there was no reason to make it widescreen which allowed the device to stay small. And by having a screen dedicated to displaying the primary gameplay, it’s able to have having a widescreen 3D display, stereo speakers and a front facing camera at the top of the device. The 3D display and the subsequent eye tracking for it were also all possible because the designers knew it would be used by one person on and they were able to exploit that.
Similarly, the Wii U was also able to offer dual screen gaming though clearly in a slightly different. It did however allow console games to have a private screen experience while still offering multiplayer on one device which allow things like asymmetric gameplay much like Pac-man Vs did on the Gamecube and had great potential for D&D-like games. As an input device and secondary screen, it would have allowed games like World of Warcraft to be ported to a console with very little change to how menus work, it wouldn’t have required a separate keyboard for chat and it’s built in speaker would have allowed voice chat without a separate headset. By incorporating all these things into the gamepad, it encouraged use of these features. Although TVii wasn’t a well implemented feature, it too was only possible because the Wii U was a dedicated home console.
By comparison, the Switch may offer the ability to play games portably or on a TV but it does away with private screen gaming outside of online play and dual screen gaming altogether. I also feel it discourages developers to make games around the use of sound as form of input by not including a microphone in the main unit or in the joycons, discourages use of the touch screen by having it no longer usable in docked mode. On a traditional console, people would have the ability to expand their storage with a lot of options including flash drives, SD cards through USB SD card readers, HDDs, and SSDs. That’s a luxury that a traditional console can provide someone because of it’s form factor. Because the Switch could only ever offer this ability through it’s dock which doesn’t come with you in handheld mode, Nintendo doesn’t plan on adding that feature and it would still be weird if they did. The 3DS was small and pocketable but was still offered at two different sizes for people with different sized hands and pockets. The Switch, especially with the JoyCons attached, isn’t really pocketable for a lot of people and can’t be shrunk because the JoyCons would have to be made even tinier and because it would negatively effect cooling and battery life on a system where battery life and cooling is already a problem.
What I’m getting at is that I simply can’t look at it as revolutionary piece of hardware when it makes so many compromises to hardware, form factor, price, and the way games are played on it. I would have much rather had a a dedicated handheld that build on the successful design and features of the 3DS and a dedicated home console with decent specs that expanding on what the Wii U did right while fixing what it did wrong. The home console still wouldn’t be able to claim tech superiority to a PC but it could at least offer all the user-friendliness and affordability of a console while offering alternative types of gameplay experiences that would require a significant investment on PCs. Hell, one of things Sony is doing with PSVR is a form of asymmetric gameplay using two screens so maybe there would have been some potential in a next-gen gamepad working double duty as a VR headset.
Hi “myownfriend” (since I don’t know your real name – I’m John, by the way) :-)
I’m sorry I haven’t had a chance to get back to you sooner, and indeed, I’m not going to be able to make a “real” reply till tomorrow at the soonest. I just wanted to drop you a quick line to say I hadn’t forgotten to respond, nor decided not to. Between family plans, a sick kiddo, putting some work into my podcast…..okay, okay, and getting sucked into Breath of the Wild (Switch version) – YET AGAIN, I just haven’t had a chance to craft a reply worthy of your reply (which was decidedly worthy). :-)
So I hope to get back to you tomorrow!
Cheers!
Hey, John. I’m Mark or Marko, it’s up to you :-)
I appreciate the update but it really wasn’t necessary. The comment section on this site shouldn’t be anybody’s priority (accept those who own the site) and I know that as somebody who has spent waaay to much time on here instead of working on my YouTube channel, helping out with my friend’s (hopeful) web series, and several other, less important projects I’ve been meaning to do (There’s been some people on DeviantArt waiting for me to continue working on a Mario 64 texture pack for three years.)
So yea, if you get back to me then ya get back to me. You’re not obliged to lol
My thoughts are the same as myownfriend’s. You’re not obligated to do anything on a comment section. Not unless you actually like the people in said comment section & want to continue chatting with them on MNN.
Well, I know that I’m not -OBLIGATED-, but I do have good faith intentions to get back. Your reply had some interesting things worth responding to, Kalas, and Mark’s reply was even more significant. I’m sitting upstairs at the gaming PC tonight, where I can’t work on the podcast, but CAN reply to you guys – rather than sitting downstairs on the podcasting Mac, where getting sucked into all the podcasting stuff would be all but totally assured. And I’m doing that specifically so that I can turn my attention your way. Hopefully (and no, I’m not promising), I’ll have something for you today. :-)
Cheers.
p.s. Mark: tell me about your YouTube channel. I’d be delighted to do a “check out for a check out” situation. My podcast is available on iTunes and all the rest….and yes….YouTube. I’m also on Facebook, Twitter and Blogspot. I do have a presence on Google+, but it’s totally neglected. My program is a video game music podcast called…..you ready for this?…….”Nerd Noise Radio”. ;-) Anyway, check me out, tell me about yours, and I’ll check you out in return! :-)
p.p.s. Kalas, if you have any sort of thing you do that you’d like us to check out, let us know. I can’t speak for Mark, but I will be more than happy to make the same “check out for a check out” deal with you that I have offered him.
I don’t do any uploading of my own content. I mostly just use youtube to follow people I like & to listen to music I like. (There was that one time with Mario Kart TV where I posted a couple of videos of me winning the final race in a Grand Prix.)
APRIL 6, 2017 AT 9:49 PM REPLY
SWITCH IS THE ONLY GEN 9 SYSTEM IN EXISTENCE IT HAS NO COMPETITION THAT IS INDUSTRY FACT TECH FACT AND PLAIN ASS REALITY
switch can do unlimited things due to it form factor NO AMOUNT OF FLOPS WILL ALLOW ME TO CONTROL A WHOLE SOCCER TEAM IN REAL TIME LIKE PES WII ONLY CONTROLLER INNOVATION WILL DO THAT
no amount of flops will allow me to dual weapons fire in a fps game only joycons dual 3d gyro mouse will allow that
no amount of flops will allow me to take my console ANYWHERE and play on and off line
no amount of flops will allow me to use a touch screen
no amount of flops will allow me full fedback in game like hd rumble
THAT IS THE FACT OF THE MATTER NOT THE OPINION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
“SWITCH IS THE ONLY GEN 9 SYSTEM IN EXISTENCE IT HAS NO COMPETITION THAT IS INDUSTRY FACT TECH FACT AND PLAIN ASS REALITY”
Who gives a shit what gen it is?
“switch can do unlimited things due to it form factor NO AMOUNT OF FLOPS WILL ALLOW ME TO CONTROL A WHOLE SOCCER TEAM IN REAL TIME LIKE PES WII ONLY CONTROLLER INNOVATION WILL DO THAT”
Unlimited? It can’t even play certain games that the Wii U did and that’s directly because of the difference in for factor. Likewise, the PS4 and Scorpio would be able to play VR games while the Switch won’t and that has everything to do with the specs that they’re able to have because of their different form factors. There is no form factor that is the best. They all have different advantages and disadvantages.
‘no amount of flops will allow me to dual weapons fire in a fps game only joycons dual 3d gyro mouse will allow that”
Dual 3D gyro mouse? Just say gyro and accelerometer, and the reason the JoyCons can do that is because they actually are two separate, different controllers meaning you shouldn’t compare them to Wii Remote and Nunchuk but two Wii Remotes which absolutely COULD do that. This is an example of claiming the JoyCons are more special than they really are.
“no amount of flops will allow me to take my console ANYWHERE and play on and off line”
No but a big enough battery will and way to go acknowledging that the Switch isn’t a home console you take on the go but a portable you connect to your TV. And actually, lets not act like FLOPS count have no bearing on something’s portability. Less capable hardware will tend to use less power and thus be easier to make battery powered.
“no amount of flops will allow me to use a touch screen”
And you can’t use the touch screen in docked mode anyway soo….
“no amount of flops will allow me to use a touch screen”
No but if other companies release controllers with linear actuators, they could do the same. They’re already in the Steam, Occulus, and Vive controllers.
“THAT IS THE FACT OF THE MATTER NOT THE OPINION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
Nobody was making the case otherwise though.
A BOX UNDER THE TV IS OBSOLETE
SPINNING DISCS ARE OBSOLETE
STANDARD RUMBLE IS OBSOLETE
NO 3M MOUSE AND MOTION IS OBSOLETE
A CONSOLE SAT UNDER A TV IS OBSOLETE
A DUALSHOCK IS OBSOLETE
PLAYING ONLINE ONLY AT HOME IS OBSOLETE
THESE ARE EVOLUTIONARY FACTS
“A BOX UNDER THE TV IS OBSOLETE”
Untrue.
“SPINNING DISCS ARE OBSOLETE ”
Pretty much.
“STANDARD RUMBLE IS OBSOLETE”
Not yet.
“NO 3M MOUSE AND MOTION IS OBSOLETE”
The fuck is a 3M mouse?
“A CONSOLE SAT UNDER A TV IS OBSOLETE”
That’s the same as your first point and it’s still untrue.
“A DUALSHOCK IS OBSOLETE”
No it’s not. That’s still what Sony calls there current controllers. If you’re talking about form factor, there’s a reason why so many people want to the Switch Pro controller. The JoyCons feels like shit in your hand especially when you have larger hands.
“PLAYING ONLINE ONLY AT HOME IS OBSOLETE”
You can’t do that on the Switch either unless you’re connected to a public WiFi hotspot or you’re pairing through your phone which is less a feature of the Switch or any console and more-so a feature of your phone which a lot of carriers charge extra for.
“THESE ARE EVOLUTIONARY FACTS”
Ev..evolutionary? Did you mean revolutionary? Even then that’s weird way to use those words and half of them were false so they’re not facts either.
I just gotta say, having a brighthouse wifi hotspot near my office day job is awesome. Can’t wait for mk8 and splatoon2! Fast RMX and bomberman is pretty fun to play on lunch breaks in the meantime ^^
DEUQALSHOCK IS 4 GENS OLD
DERP SHITES I HAVENT ANALOG STICK AIMED SINCE 2006 IM A GAMER NOT A BLIND ASS ROBOT CLUNKY ASS CONTROLLER DEFENDER
I GAME WITH JOYCONS PRO PAD SWITCH AND STEAM CONTROLLER DUALSHOCK MIS EMBARRASSING
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32ADym9Za6o
BU BU BU BUT GFLOPS lol no portable mode no table top mode no hd rumble and graphically near identical SHUT UP HARDLY CORES YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT GAMING
SCORPIO COMES WITH A SPINNING DISC DRIVE AND A SPINNING HARDDRIVE
SWITCH IS 10% NO MOVING PARTS MEDIA SOLID STAE CARTS AND SOLID STATE SDCARDS AND SOLID STATE FLASH
come @ me bro STUPID LITTLE FANBOYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I’m a Nintendo fan, dipshit.
And while I’m all for newer technologies don’t act like MicroSD cards have every advantage over HDDs. Many MicroSD cards are also slower than HDDS. When it comes to owners of the Scorpio, XBO, PS4, PS4 Pro, or even the Wii U, they all of their options. They can save money and get HDDs which are cheaper per GB, or they get can an SSD which are more expensive than HDDs per GB but cheaper per GB than MicroSD cards and are significantly faster, or they can go the low-profile route and use a flash drive which is still cheaper per GB than MicroSD and faster.
On the moving fact he is right 100%. It make it far more strudier than competition. You can actually make an hard drive corrupt by just moving it when writing. Solid state it’s far better technology, it contains little data… true, but it’s not a problem with this generation (eventually it will not get 50 gigs games, and you can delete a game and re-download it when you want it while mantaining saves. Buy a 64/128 GB card and you are set. At least if you don’t dislike cartridges to flank it (but why you should?).
Oh I completely understand that solid state things are more durable but PS4 and XBO also aren’t portable so the chances of them being dropped or shook is significantly lower. If they were portable, then sure solid state would be the only sensible thing for them to use. But as home consoles, it’s just more consumer friendly to give people different options for different budgets.
On topic of moving parts though, he is not write in saying the Switch is 100% non-moving parts as it does have fan which runs in portable and docked mode. It may be a delicate as a hard drive , it is alarming to me since, even in my own limited experience with the Switch, it gets hot. If a fall should disable the fan without the owner knowing, it could no doubt easily overheat especially when docked. I realize this is unrelated to the topic of storage though..
Not 100%, right, but a fan it’s far less delicate than a hard drive. Especially that type of fan. It got thrown to floor and everything worked out. It’s pretty solid.
I haven’t experienced overheating with it, though these things eventually come out in summer.
I expect Nintendo QA is still top so I’m not gonna worrying about it, not like with the X360.
It’s still something that is better to not be in a portable. If not just for durability concerns and the resulting over-heating concerns then because of the additional power it draws. The one in the Switch uses about 1.65 watts which isn’t trivial on a battery powered device. If the typical battery life is 3 hours and it has a 15.9 Wh battery then that puts power usage of the whole system at only around 5 watts. If my math is correct than the fan could account for 33% of the battery life and the Switch would last an additional hour without it.
The desperation of the Switch fanboys is quite funny to watch. Just be happy the damn thing is where it’s at & what it is capable of doing. No need to pretend it’s something it’s not. Otherwise, you are all just gonna get hugely let down when games similar to Horizon Zero Dawn don’t come to the Switch as powerful or graphically demanding as you all so blindly hope they will be. Then again, fanboys will go into full on denial mode & see what’s not really there. *shrug*
A next-gen game (GTA V) got ported on a simple PS3 (512 megs). I don’t think it would be difficult to port the others on the Nintendo Switch. Horizon Zero Dawn definitely not since it’s a Sony game. ;)
Okay. GTAV isn’t the best example because of being on PS3 but Horizon is another matter entirely. Sure it could work on the Switch… after it’s been specially designed to work on Switch after having everything making it so data heavy is removed or underclocked. I like BotW but it’s nowhere near as graphically demanding as Horizon. Hence why BotW wasn’t designed with realistic graphics & is simply improving on the graphics Skyward Sword used.
Point is that, you can port games by reducing graphics quality. There will be people appreciating the possibility of taking those games with them when going out, or playing them with the Joy-Con.
Can’t get to that graphics but still push out high quality graphics.
If I have to choose one console I choose the Nintendo Switch, because it’s more versatile (and loves Nintendo games). I did it. Graphics is important but it’s not just that when I buy games.
I play Fast RMX often lying on my bed, I can’t do it with the PC or the other consoles. And about graphics… it got plenty. It’s not a Wii. ^^
Textures on BotW aren’t its strong poin, though graphically is still good. I don’t think art direction went with cartoon because it was underpowered. GC wasn’t underpowered and it got Wind Waker. PlayStation 4 wasn’t underpowered and it got Dragon Quest X. Wii was underpowered and it got Twilight Princess (realistic).
It’s more about artistic choice. And I feel a cartoonish game is less demanding in working hours, and BotW already got 300 people working on it.
Of course an indie developer would say that, since they’re not exactly known for putting out big triple A titles.
Yet there are still games developers refuse to port to the Switch, like Marvel vs Capcom Infinite.
I guess some Switch fanboys will latch on to anything to believe the Switch is gonna be the Nintendo 1st party & 3rd party machine they’ve always wanted. (While I hope they end up being right, I’m not gonna be disappointed if it turns out WE’RE right.)