It’s no surprise that with the Nintendo Switch already out and available to consumers that Nintendo is currently thinking of what to bring to the table next. Of course, whatever they decide to create next will be a long way off, so don’t worry.
Nintendo President Is Already Thinking What They Can Bring After The Switch
It should come out in 2022 or early 2023. If backwards compatible with this Switch (assuming it will be Switch 2.0) then that would be the perfect time, about a year after PS5
2023
I dont think it’s going to be branded as a switch 2.0 because i think they have learned their lesson from the wii u.
No, that is exactly why it will be… The WiiU should have been branded as Wii 2 or WiiHD but it wasn’t and it became confusing. Switch is great name and I think they are all in on the home/handheld console
It can be called Switch X2 or X? homing whatever new Nvidia X series chip the next console will bring and can do 1440p or something with AR/VR and stuff.
I have doubts on it.
I sense that Nvidia will help develop a more powerful chip that can help Nintendo’s next system actually outmatch the PS5 and the NEXbox
I think another company will b involved for there next console.
No. Nvidia is a great platform for powerful portability hardware and seeing that the Switch is a runaway success with a new concept never attempted/succeeded before, they’ll stick around with Nintendo and help make good business with each other.
Mmm I guess that makes sense. I guess they can work together again if Nintendo Switch sales goes to 30 million.
Oh it will by mid-late 2018. Nvidia will see this console as a golden opportunity to jump into the gaming market.
Regardless of the company, Nintendo will have the ability to gamble a little more with cost so to get the most out of the console and whatever the latest tech is at the time. It is gonna be win for everyone.
They should go with a semi-custom SoC with licensed CPU and GPU designs. Nvidia didn’t make anything custom for Nintendo for the Switch at the follow-ups to the chip they’re using in the Switch are increasingly designed for self-driving cars. They have additional GPU power but most of the enhancements are for more cameras and they’re starting to target higher power usage.
If they wanted to the outmatch the “PS5 and NEXbox”, it can’t be a hybrid. Both will likely attempt to exceed what the Xbox One X and PS4 Pro are which means more than 6 TFLOPS of GPU computation and 320GB/s of memory bandwidth. The Switch is currently at less than .4 TFLOPS. with 25.6GB/s of memory bandwidth.
In 5 or 6 years, mobile chips may reach a performance similar to the XBO or PS4 but it’s just the nature of technology that the less power and heat restricted designs are going to be able to outperform them significantly. Sony and Microsoft will likely look to push out new consoles on 3 or 4 years from now.
Switch is actually 1 Teraflop. WTF are you getting your info from? BTW, who’s to say that Nvidia isn’t in the gaming business nor making anything for gaming? THEY ARE and should remain with Nintendo because their chips are as equally powerful and affordable which is Nintendo’s calling for powerful consoles at a cheaper cost for consumer. It’ll be hard to let that go now. They used AMD before and didn’t work out.
Switch is actually 1 Teraflop. WTF are you getting your info from?
It isn’t. The 1 teraflop number that Nvidia touted for the TX1 is half-precision or 16-bit flops which are accurate enough for most fragment shaders but generally you want to compare consoles 32-bit or full-precision floating point performance since 32-bit math can be used for all vertex shaders and fragment shaders.
In that respect, a TX1 could only do 0.5 TFLOPS or 512 GFLOPS, while PS4 can do 1.84 TFLOPS, Xbox One can do 1.31 TFLOPS, Xbox One S can do 1.4 TFLOPS, PS4 Pro can do 4.1 TFLOPS, and XBox One X can do 6 TFLOPS. The latter two can also do double precision FP16 though so, if you want to be fair then you would compare the TX1’s 1 16-it TFLOPS to the PS4 Pro’s 8.2 16-bit TFLOPS and the XBOX One X’s 12 16-bit TFLOPS.
The thing with the Switch is that it uses an underclocked TX1. Instead of being 1Ghz, it’s 768Mhz in docked mode and 307.2 or 384Mhz in handheld mode. That makes there max theoretical 32-bit floating point performance just 393.216 GFLOPS in docked mode and 157.3 to 196.6 GFLOPS in handheld mode. These are clock rates that were provided to Eurogamer by a developer with a final dev kit and a developer on this site that is working on a Switch game confirmed this to me.
Either way, you should not use max theoretical floating point performance as an absolute measure of a processors ability. Those values are determined algorithmically and determined by multiplying the amount of cores, the clock speed, and the amount of operations performed in a Multiply-Add operation which is two. In other words, since a fully clocked TX1 has it’s GPU clocked at 1Ghz it would be 1000 Mhz x 256 cores x 2 FLOPS per MADD = 512 GFLOPS x 2 FP16 operations per core = 1000 GFLOPS.
BTW, who’s to say that Nvidia isn’t in the gaming business nor making anything for gaming?
They themselves announced that they were leaving they were transitioning the Tegra line out of the mobile market and focusing it toward self-driving cars. They had initially just left the mobile phone market which is why they made the Tegra K1 and X1 which were impressive for their time because they targeted tablet power and heat characteristics. Still, Apple’s tablet chip beat them pretty considerable just 3 months after the first TX1-based device came out. Since the release of the TX1, it’s only shown up in two other devices, the Google Pixel C and the Nintendo Switch. The TX2, which came out just after the Switch came out, improves on the TX1’s performance by just 50% and the chip after that, currently codenamed Xavier, is chip about the same size as the PS4’s at launch and targets a power usage of about 30 watts and is thus well out of the power usage of a tablet.
THEY ARE and should remain with Nintendo because their chips are as equally powerful and affordable which is Nintendo’s calling for powerful consoles at a cheaper cost for consumer.
Nvidia, for the most part, is king in the desktop space but they’re dead last in the mobile GPU space. Mobile GPU’s like Qualcomm’s Adreno, ARM’s Mali, and Imagination’s PowerVR can all perform as well in phone as the Switch can when it’s docked. All have also been ahead of Nvidia when it comes to supporting double speed half-precision FLOPS and supporting newer texture compressions like ASTC. And as for power and affordability, the Apple TV 4K, which uses a GPU designed licensed from Imagination, is about twice as powerful as the Switch and can be bought for $180, the same price as the Shield TV which uses a standard clocked TX1. Let’s not also forget that both the XBO is $170 now and the PS4 is about $200. Nintendo isn’t calling for powerful consoles that are cost effective for consumers. If they were, then they wouldn’t have used an underclocked off-the-shelves tablet Soc from 2015 that’s manufactured on outdate process and then sold it for $300 with extra controllers that are $70 to $80 and an extra dock that $90.
Nintendo doesn’t need to work with Nvidia. They can make their own SOC using licensed CPU designs from ARM and licensed GPU designs from Imagination or ARM. That will allow them to cut out of the middle man and make a chip that’s more suited to their needs. Had they done this with the Switch, they could have made a legitimate claim that their CPU performance would be on-par with or exceding other consoles and they could have made a GPU that performs at close to the Switch’s docked performance while in handheld mode and about twice as performance in docked mode.
It’ll be hard to let that go now. They used AMD before and didn’t work out.
Everybody else is using AMD and it worked out just fine for them. Sure, those systems are tablets and AMD would suck for a tablet system but it shows that AMD was not at the route of Nintendo’s previous lack of success. The rumor awhile back was that Nintendo was using the TX1 simply because Nvidia begged.
All bullshit to shoot down Nintendo. I’m not falling for it.
What? All of it? Because it’s all true. Don’t do the same shit people did with the Wii U. I saw someone still claiming the Wii U was as powerful as the PS4 only a few weeks ago.
Don’t believe the PS4 is a lot more capable than the TX1?
Just look at benchmarks. The HD 7850 is a 1.76 TFLOPS with 154 GB/s bandwidth and from the same architecture of the PS4 so it’s slightly less capable than the PS4. Then there’s the Pixel C which is a tablet that uses the TX1.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=4679&os1=OS+X&api1=metal&hwtype1=dGPU&hwname1=AMD+Radeon+HD+7850&D2=Google+Pixel+C
If you don’t like comparing benchmarks between different APIs and OSs then I can show you the gap architecturally.
Here’s benchmarks for the HD 7850 vs the Nvidia GTX 950. The GTX 950 is a 1.57 TFLOPS card that uses the same Maxwell architecture that the Switch uses so we can this for comparison.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=4679&os1=OS%20X&api1=metal&hwtype1=dGPU&hwname1=AMD+Radeon+HD+7850&did2=26938090&os2=OS%20X&api2=metal&hwtype2=dGPU&hwname2=NVIDIA+GeForce+GTX+950
As you can see, those cards perform pretty much equally so we know that the Maxwell set up used in the 950 is the one that will get PS4-like performance, but what is that set up?
Well, a GTX 950 is clocked at 1024 Mhz with a boost clock of 1188 Mhz, so we already know that it’s clocked about as high as the TX1 but can boost about 150Mhz faster.
But how many cores does it have, and how are they layed out? Well the Maxwell architecture has it’s cores grouped into SMMs which hold 128 cores each. The GTX 950 has six SMMs placed in two GPCs, three SMMs per GPC.
The TX1 has two SMMs in one GPC. That means it has 1/3rd the amount of cores and half the amount of texture units and raster output units so fill rate is halved compared to the 950. In other words, at max, it can only be 1/3rd the performance of the PS4.
However, the TX1 is being further choked by using 3200MT LPDDR4 on a 64-bit bus because it only has 25.6 GB/s of memory bandwidth which is a little less than 1/4th the amount of bandwidth available to the 950. That’s what preventing the Switch from being able to consistently bring games up to 1080p in docked mode. In order for it to get similar amount of bandwidth to computing power as the 950, it would need access to about 35.3 GB/s of memory bandwidth.
If you need proof that the afore mentioned 1 teraflops rating is for half-precision floats…
Then just check the Wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegra#Tegra_X1
Or read about the TX1 on Anandtech.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/8811/nvidia-tegra-x1-preview/2
or read the official white paper about the TX1 from Nvidia.
http://international.download.nvidia.com/pdf/tegra/Tegra-X1-whitepaper-v1.0.pdf
Don’t believe that the TX1 was outperformed just three months after it was released?
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=27138730&os1=iOS&api1=metal&hwtype1=GPU&hwname1=Apple+A9X+GPU&D2=NVIDIA+Shield+Android+TV
Don’t believe Nvidia is trasitioning the Tegra line away from tablet and smart phone computing?
Here’s the CEO saying it himself.
https://www.guru3d.com/news_story/nvidia_tegra_no_longer_is_an_soc_for_phones_and_tablets.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/greatspeculations/2015/05/07/nvidia-to-sell-its-icera-business-exit-the-mobile-chip-market/#6f951d0a76e9
Don’t believet that Nvidia isn’t a success in the tablet space?
http://appleinsider.com/articles/15/01/23/how-amd-and-nvidia-lost-the-mobile-gpu-chip-business-to-apple-with-help-from-samsung-and-google-
Don’t believe the XBox One X and PS4 Pro support half-precision floating point?
Well, I just figured out that Microsoft opted out of supporting it so I was wrong in respect to the XBO X, the PS4 Pro DOES support FP16 though.
https://wccftech.com/two-future-amd-features-debuting-ps4-pro-watch-dogs-2-mass-effect-andromeda-run-1800p/
Don’t believe that other mobile GPUs beat Nvidia to the punch with FP16 support?
Just look at PowerVR’s Rogue GPUs which supported it in 2012, 3 years before Nvidia introduced it to he Tegra line.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerVR#Series6_(Rogue)
While you’re there, take note of that fact that PowerVR had a mobile GPU architecture capable of 1 32-bit teraflops and 2 16-bit teraflops back in the November of 2014. Nintendo had enough time that they could have used this chip and taken advantage of the improvements in the 7XT Plus update along the way. Btw, the 7XT Plus introduced integer units that can process 16-bit ints at double speed and 8-bit ints at 4x speed. This feature would have provided an excellent speed up for emulating the Gamecube and Wii’s GPU which uses lower precision integer math at several point in its GPU pipeline including it’s TEV unit.
Don’t believer there are smartphones that are competitive with a docked Switch?
Check it out.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=38668414&os1=iOS&api1=metal&hwtype1=GPU&hwname1=Apple+A10+GPU&D2=Google+Pixel+C
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=28156617&os1=Android&api1=gl&hwtype1=GPU&hwname1=NVIDIA%28R%29+Tegra%28R%29+X1&D2=Samsung+Galaxy+S8%2B+%28Mali-G71%2C+SM-G955x%29
And I’m just using the those as example as example of GPU architectures that Nintendo could have actually used. Here’s a benchmark versus Apple’s custom GPU.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=28156617&os1=Android&api1=gl&hwtype1=GPU&hwname1=NVIDIA%28R%29+Tegra%28R%29+X1&did2=54321051&os2=iOS&api2=metal&hwtype2=GPU&hwname2=Apple+Inc.+Apple+A11+GPU
Of course, the licensable GPU used in the iPhone 7 could have gotten closer to those scores if it was manufactured on a 10nm process like the iPhone 8’s. That’s evident by the fact that the one time they made a 10nm tablet SoC using that GPU, it got scores like this.
https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx40&did1=28156617&os1=Android&api1=gl&hwtype1=GPU&hwname1=NVIDIA%28R%29+Tegra%28R%29+X1&did2=51079623&os2=iOS&api2=metal&hwtype2=iGPU&hwname2=Apple+Inc.+Apple+A10X+GPU
The chip in the 2017 iPad Pro, the A10X, is getting that performance with passive cooling. That same chip is being used in the aforementioned $180 Apple TV 4k but with active cooling.
Which is why this game was announced alongside it.
Anyway..
My point is that the Switch is NOT a powerhouse that’s anywhere near as powerful as the PlayStation 4. That’s just the nature of having a “hybrid” system that uses older mobile chips from a company who failed in the mobile market.
Don’t “fake news” me.
||The Supreme Lord will find a way to destroy the Sonyan imbeciles…||
But we have to destroy the Xbot first
They’re already at the end of their ropes. Sony is next.
||That was implied as they will no longer exist at all by that time…||
Keeping dreaming, Commander. Like Nintendo, Sony is here to stay. (They just need to cut off the diseased limb that is their movie division.)
||The creature Michael created a secondary account to promote his pathetic hatred against me, isn’t this utterly pathetic?…||
*checks the date & sees it is not January 1st yet* If so, it’s quite sad, really… Poor creature should stop caring so much about what other people do with their time on here… Or anywhere as I imagine he probably has issues with people in other places that are eccentric compared to him. *shrug* Not our problem.
https://mynintendonews.com/2017/12/28/suda51-nintendo-has-really-started-caring-more-about-indies/comment-page-1/#comment-2629412
And the computing, appliance, music, fuck..everything else. They might as well become a gaming company and then be destroyed by Nintendo.
Right now, Nintendo is the only Console Developer using Nvidia hardware. Maybe Nvidia will be highly motivated to show off their technical prowess with the next Nintendo platform?
I think another company will be involved for the next one.
Nvidia is making so much with the Nintendo Switch that they will want to make a deal with whatever comes next.
Yes, but sometimes the company can’t make a perfect deal with one another. I think it’s very obvious that Nintendo might approaching them again.
Oh they will by the way the Switch is going. If Switch with X2/X3 update comes around late 2019 with a new console a few years after, I’m down with it.
Me too. Besides I honestly I have hopes for Nintendo to make everything well for the company.
Not exactly. PCs are also using Nvidia but as a portable/console level, Nintendo is the only one and that’s why the Switch is already winning.
I disagree with your last sentence and I mentioned that in my first comment. :p
With what? Nintendo Switch winning? lol
Yeah… Nvidia has nothing to do with Nintendo winning. It’s always the weapons on the platform.
I’m just waiting for the day when Nintendo puts out a console with heavy spec’s.
*Rim Shots…..*
You mean like the Nintendo 64?
N64 lost because of opting with expensive cartridges due to losing out CD media deals.
You mean Gamecube?
LMAO x 2!
🕵
this is exciting news! they will obviously plan a Stronger Switch type of machine. focusing on that dual home-portable console idea, with better specs! hopefully ones that can compete with the next gen PS4 and Xbox, and if they embrace consumers opinion and they do, it will be a very good sign for us nintendo fans to enjoy nintendo products for years to come
There’s no way a portable device on par with the next generation Xbox and PS5 wouldn’t cost significantly more. Power, portability, and affordability don’t mix well in the tech world.
Wanna bet? Switch right now can be matched to standard PS4 in a way. Who’s to say that the next console after Switch won’t be as powerful?
It can run some of the same games but it’s in no way at the same level and the Switch costs $300. I’m just living in reality. Switch 2 will not match the specs of PS5.
Even if Switch is using a Tegra X3 or whatever, it will never outmatch a next gen PS/XBOX. Just look at the power consumption. It’s not like it’s a definitive way of measuring performance, but when you have a thing plugged into the wall and uses 5-20x amount the power, and the other is on batteries, you know there’ll be a difference.
But we’ll just wait and see what’s next. Maybe they will integrate a SLI-bridge between the handheld and the dock? Would be awesome.
What’s an SLI-bridge?
It’s nVidia’s name/tech for connecting graphics cards together.
Realistically, no. Close enough on an affordable/convenient level? Yes.
They will keep the company strong.
As Mike said, there’s no way that’s possible. Thermal and power constraints alone would limit it from outperforming a dedicated home console. By the time that next gen console come out, there may be mobile chips that are similar in performance to the XBO and PS4, but if you’re expecting an 8 or 10 TFLOP GPU in mobile form factor by that time, you’re setting yourself up for disappointment.
There’s a huge difference between how handhelds and consoles are designs in terms of cost as well. For example, the 4GB of LPDDR4 in the Switch gets them 25.6GB/s bandwidth and costs them about $19. The 8GB of DDR3 in the Xbox One S gives them about 68.3GB/s bandwidth and costs them about them same amount of money. The reason is because that 4GB LPDDR4 is two really high bandwidth chips that uses very little power and can connect to the memory controller using only 64 wires and that costs more money. That 8 GB of DDR3 is sixteen lower-bandwidth chips that connect to a memory controller with 256 wires, it’s a lot cheaper but uses more power.
I hope it will still play current switch games and we’ll be able to transfer data.
It looks like Nintendo are going to receive an impressive amount of customers now and we should now HOPEFULLY start to experience more 3rd party titles.
This could be like history repeating NES to SNES and now switch to ?????.
I think Nintendo have learnt a lot from the wii u, but then the most successful people/companies learn from making mistakes them selves and then coming out stronger. This is looking very likely as time goes on with the switch sales.
Good to hear but a Switch deluxe should be pushed through next year. A machine with a 1080p 7 inch screen with the same power as a PS4. The PS4 still has at least 2 years of aaa games from 3rd party’s, if Nintendo can go to them with a machine that takes minimum effort to port a game to the same spec, as well as first party support it would be hard to turn down. Yes the games would have to be downscaled for the current Switch console like Doom, Rocket league. It’s clear that every 3rd party is seriously looking at Switch and if they can bring the same game to all current Gen machines at the same spec it would be hugely attractive to them. Also it wouldn’t be massively expensive to produce, 1080p screen and PS4 level specs are 4 year old tech. Keep the same size Switch frame and same joycon and dock. Up the battery and a 500 gb hard drive.
You haven’t got a clue if you believe all that is possible.
You want them to release a new Switch within the next 368 days when the first one isn’t even a year old? Are you insane?
That’s inpossible dude.
There is no way they can wait until 2022/23 for a follow-up console. IMO you will see some sort of upgraded system by 2019’s holiday season. Spring of 2020 at the latest.
They’re not talking about a new 3DS type upgrade. They’re talking about a next gen System after the Switch.
Until they get all the third party support that the Playstation has, they will never match the Snes ever again from a gaming perspective. Playstation consoles basicly offer what the Snes library used to offer just witouth Mario, Zelda and Metroid. Nintendo first party has been lacking allot aswell ever since the n64 that offered a 3d Star Fox , 3d Donkey Kong , Diddy Kong Racing , Banjo Kazooi , Conker , Perfect Dark , goldeneye , F-Zero , Pilot Wings , Wave Race and probally some more.
These days you buy a Nintendo just to play Mario wich got pretty boring since Mario Sunshine (no challenge ect. still feels the same) , Zelda and Metroid wich hasn’t had a strong game since Prime 3 in 2007. We can argue about Mario Kart and Smash Bros I like Mario Kart but it’s pretty boring if you can’t play it with your friends every weekend while getting wasted and I never liked Smash Bros pressing 3 buttons only but thats just personal prefference. Most of there franchises died out , or still offer the same 2d stuff people already played in the 80’s or aren’t used at all (been waiting for a real console pokemon since 1996 for example)
I might have forgotten to name a few games here and there but this basicly sums it up for me and most people I know.
For me the perfect console would have ps4/pc/xbox third party with Nintendo first party reviving there franchises on the level of breath of the wild , Metroid Prime and Mario Galaxy/3d/Odessey I suppose. No cheap 2d versions or Star Fox that looks the same as the n64 version from 1997 or no home console version at collecting dust in the Nintendo franchise library.
I’m sure allot of you will hate my opinion but I have been around Nintendo for nearly 30 years so I know how it used to be unlike allot of you. Even so its still my personal opinion I just know allot of people who feel the same as me.
Ohh this is going to be good.
On a serious note though, it will be interesting to see how Nintendo decideds to evolve the Switch. To say that the Switch has been a hit for Nintendo would be putting it lightly. It’s a major change from what the Wii U is, and I would think they try and follow along the lines of Switch, but how to make it better? Release a beefed up version of a better Switch, or start from the ground up again?
It’s crazy, I can’t see them releasing anything too soon, given the Switch’s recent success. I feel like they’re going to be pushing the Switch for a while.
Maybe.
I’m sure someone thought the same about Wii when it was doing so well but look what happened: it’s last 2 years were pretty bad. It was sadly a precursor to one of the Wii U’s biggest issues: barely any games from them. :/
Nintendo don’t need more power.. they need to invest a compressor for 3rd party companies.
Image if the Switch 2 could do 4K games(for the TV part), and the AVG 3rd game only needs like 32GB instead of all these terrabtes!
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I was sort of hoping we could live in the present for a little while, the Switch is doing great. I’d rather they put more manpower into making games and worry about a new console when it actually matters, right now the others are just doing incrimental updates, can’t we just make a more powerful switch and call it a day?
I thought the Switch was made so that Nintendo could keep adding more power and features, therefore extending the life of the console (I don’t know the professional words for what I’m talking about). But it sounds to me like the Switch will have the same lifespan as every console. I can’t believe it still doesn’t have an internet browser.
You must be referring to that external supplemental power device thingy (forgot the exact words they used for it) to improve a system’s capabilities & such. (If they are still working on that, it could end up being an enhanced dock.)
Nintys next console should be just a console. Don’t get me wrong I love them being different :) but time to go back to formula haha GameCube 2… Wii was a revolution (as that was it’s codename) and diff with its motion controls… WiiU was odd with its screen on the controller and still could play Wii games… And then Switch, great idea and all with lil joy con things and portable gaming, great… But next just be a powerhouse, on par with the X now… A awesome controller made and make it grey and like a triangle or something lol
I agree, nintynate. I hope their next console is a more traditional home console. With normal controllers like the Pro Controllers (I love those). Also it would be nice if it had at least 1TB of internal memory.
If I’m not mistaken Nintendo president said that they want to do something similar to what they did with the 3DS. We may see an upgraded Switch in two years even if the next console is scheduled to release in 5 or 6 years.
You mean they’ll finally add Streetpass/Download Play? ^_^
The download play will really help the concept of being a portable/home console and in 2 years they can make a Switch with a battery that lass longer, which will made download play more enjoyable for those who don’t have time to play at home. Imagine playing Zelda Breath of the Wild for almost 4 hours.
We can do better. Let’s make it 6 hours.
GameCube lost due to going with CD media but it’s a micro disc and had everybody scratch their heads again.