Famed Wedbush Morgan analyst Michael Pachter isn’t a fan of controversial on-disc downloadable content, claiming it’s nothing but profit greed. Pachter even when as far to say that gamers are entitled to hack the disc to retrieve the downloadable content that should have shipped with the retail copy.
“The stuff on the disc, some gamers feel entitled to because they bought the disc, so they should have a right to anything that’s on the disc,” he said. “And that’s a dicey one, you actually do own the disc and I think, theoretically, if you could crack the code on the DLC you probably would be allowed to access it without paying. And I’m not even sure that’s stealing because you did, in fact, buy the disc. That’s about as close as you can get to legal piracy.”
Wow, finally something this guy said I can agree with…
Exactly what I was gonna say. This guy isn’t 100% a**hole after all.
I found this quote quite cool, but I am still not going to get suckered into liking him, he just wants to better his relationship with … everyone.. Except publishers, nobody cares if publishers like you.
the only time patcher is ever right is when it is something that is total common sense. like when he says that nintendo needs a strong first party line up, or that no one likes the idea of not being able to play used games, the rest of the time he’s a total douche.
Yes.
Holy shart! Pachter said something intelligent!
DAMN YOU PACHTER!!! throwing a curve ball at us like that…
Lately, he’s been rather sensible about the Wii U. I guess he’s even pumped about finding the truth at E3
WOW! Pachter says something that is RIGHT and TRUE!?
Yes but it is also common sense.
uncharacteristicly sensible even.
I never though I’d agree with this man on anything . . . . But this is the exception.
Patcher finally said something which the ENTIRE gaming community can agree with! A round of applause for Pachter, a Stand Ovation even.
I can actually… agree with him on this one…
Patcher talking sense? What kind of messed-up Bizzaro world have I stumbled into?!?
he is absolutely right. what capcom is doing with the Street Fighter X Tekken bonus characters is WRONG! all of them are on disc, yet they want us to pay 1600msp (Xbox 360) or $19.99 (PS3), also, they want us to wait till AUGUST! do you have any idea how many copies of that game i’ve seen on the pre-owned rack at GameStop since it came out? about 50. if anyone is guilty of this on-disc-DLC-you-pay-for-bullshit, its CAPCOM! Not Sony, Not EA, Not Nintendo, Not Namco-Bandai, Not Microsoft, and Not Konami.
ITS ALL CAPCOM. Gamers should band together and sue the company for their wrongdoings. its because of a company like that, is why people think the gaming industry is corrupt.
Let’s not sit here and act like Capcom is the only company doing that BS
capcom is not the only company doing it, but they are certaintly the most guilty of doing it.
Wrong. While it doesn’t make them any less guilty, this entire generation has been filled with games with on-disc DLC. Capcom was one of the first companies to have one of their games hacked and the on-disc content being discovered though.
Why do Americans always want to sue somebody?
Because they’re Americans.
+1
+2 and for that the Mother series can NOT be bring outside Japan
America likes money a little too much :P I know, I live there.
We sue ppl because we can. Enjoy your rights.
Wouldnt it be funny if Americans who sued, got counter-sued by other Americans…
I can here J P Morgan getting excited already! XD
Agreed, too bad the people on this site will rage against it just for hearing the name Pachter. This site is to Pachter as Fox News is to Obama. Also, don’t twist the title like that, he never said that it was plain greed and you’re entitled to hack it, he said some people feel entitled to hack it and he sees it as legal piracy.
Hush mook.
The site is to pachter as Gamespot is to Nintendo :)
Even though i agree with what he says, I dont like the words “Pachter” and “Entitled” in the same sentence…
its a trap!
It’s official… Pachter is not a pinhead or douchebag. It’s a freakin’ miracle!
I guess I will be the first person to disagree with him then, especially since I know previously he has said he is for DLC.
I don’t think it should be possible to be ok with DLC and then angry when it is on-disk = all that means is that you know it won’t completely break the online multiplayer later on (like the travesty that was the online Mortal Kombat system having players forced to download a pack which they then could not see because they didn’t buy it just so that the other player who bought it could use it – and it would happen for almost every game for people with these packs having to wait for the other perso’n’s internet to download it).
I would rather a game I can actually play which costs me less, but I get less content and if I like it I can get more content for paying more without completely breaking the entire game – than DLC which completely screws up an entire aspect of the game I bought – even if I choose not to buy it.
So you would rather have a quarter of the game’s content withheld than have to download compatibility patches? That seems quite silly.
I can put up with downloading patches for added content since, gasp, it usually means it’s *added* content, and not just locked content meant to get a few extra bucks from complacent gamers.
Yes I would prefer that – because it makes better games.
I want games that work better. I would rather a 4 hour experience that I will actually remember (like Portal or Mirror’s Edge) than a padded out one which doesn’t work all the time. And that goes into DLC as well.
The point is most of the time DLC has been planned and made before the game comes out – and you can’t be so naive as to think since it wasn’t on the disk then it lacks any acts of greed.
No these things are thought through and heavily tested and developers know that continuous DLC content continues the lifespan of the game, the games are generally remembered more favourably and in a lot of cases it actually improves the game by simply releasing it at certain times.
For instance the biggest use is in fighting games – the reason for this is because if everyone has all the characters at the start they only try a few characters once, then denounce them and use a small group of characters before complaining about a lack of variability in the classes and how overall the game is broken with only the same characters appearing online. With DLC you can release it later so that the same people now have more time to try out each individual character and learn the ins an douts (as they will be more inclined to spend time with a “new” character than they would at the start if it was not a style they preferred originally).
The on-disk side fixes the problem of these “added content” breaking the entire game having to download often and creating a disconect between the online community fragmenting it.
It is simply a use of developing a players experience without resorting to constant downloads. Imagine in a game with a levelling mechanic forcing you to download something everytime you levelled up – it cost you something *time and effort to unlock* -you didn’t have it at the start -and it is up to the developer to decide when you can have it. It serves the same place as DLC and it is on disk since downloading it would cause way too many problems to be implimented. The only difference is that for on-disk DLC the cost to unlock it is money and time (but with the time you can spend doing other things rather than having to play this game).
It doesn’t fix stupid choices for DLC (such as defining a core game mechanic as a cost to the player) because that is a problem in any form of DLC. But it does fix the cost to players who don’t want to buy it (so they don’t have to download it before every online match without being able to then see it – just wasting their time) and the performance problems are fixed.
And the greed problem is completely irrelevant as making the DLC on disk or not doesn’t change the greed of the person – someone taking out content to sell isn’t suddenly less greedy because they took it off the retail disk. Both forms of DLC are just as greed-ridden. That is a moral choice everyone has to take on their own as to if they are for it or against it – but they have to ask it thinking about DLC as a whole as it plagues all forms of it.
What you’re describing for the majority of this post is insanity. You appear to enjoy paying for something that videogame companies have been doing for FREE since they began: unlockable content.(not on-disc DLC, or regular DLC.) I feel the greed statement is 100% accurate here.
No I am not. You completely ignored everything I said. My point was that On-Disk DLC are the same as normal DLC. And that DLC has a core reason for it (for use in unlocking content over time, creating revenue and coverage as news).
My point is that anyone can be against it on a moral ground from something free becoming a cost. That is legitimate – In fact I am on-the-whole for that. My arguement is that simply hating On-Disk DLC while liking normal DLC is moronic.
Either hate both as greed, or neither (anything else is hippocritical). The Greed angle is irrelevant when differentiating between normal DLC and on-disk DLC as both are just as money-grubbing.
You’re some kind of dumb, you know that.
The main thing to point out: Development funds run dry. The ideal sitation would be if a developer simply delayed the release of the game until everything on the disc was finished, it’s not always possible.
That said, if they plan on paid off-disc DLC and there’s suddenly a cost involved with on-disc DLC then that becomes a questionable practice. They can refine it and release the final version later, but not at a charge.
Your avatar….IS FREAKIN AWESOME.
The jury is now out… I still think the man is an idiot, because as Dixavd said, it does not take into account Patched DLC. This is something Little Big Planet and Little Big Planet 2 have been notorious for.
First sensible thing to come out of the guy’s mouth.
So finally they released a patch for pacht, seems they ironed out all the bugs with this one
Ha! I see what you did there!
I dont care as i havent bought a console game for over 5 years…
I always wait for a serial crack and pirate everything.
Why throw money away and bitch to strangers online?
Just wait a few years and get everything for free!
Because it’s illegal? Seriously though, I’ve pirated a few NDS roms in my day and its no big deal, but a few ISP’s are starting to crack down on it and if they catch you downloading too much illegal stuff they take away your internet access for a whole year.
You know, I agree with Patcher on this, it is corporate greed. If you going to make a game and DLC for it to ship on the same disc, most the time at launch and then require us to buy the DLC to use it I find your going against the consumer. DLC is meant to be additions to the game to add more story and add some re-playability to some games.
So with that said isn’t this just adding something to make profit off of making profit?
He’s right. It wouldn’t be stealing. You own the disc. You are entitled to do whatever you like with it, including: breaking it in half, playing with it like a frisbee, or hacking it.
Legally, if it’s a commercial closed source product, then hacking the disc is illegal. It’s not ‘stealing’, but it’s a different crime enforced by different laws.
That being said, I agree with Pachter from a moral point-of-view. You should be entitled to hack the disc, you paid for it.
Wrong. Hacking the disc isn’t illegal, but it as a violation of the EULA (End User License Agreement). The EULA is basically a TOU that you agree to without reading anything simply by purchasing digital content. The EULA is why Microsoft can ban you from XBL for hacking, but Capcom can’t press criminal charges for hacking, because you violated an agreement but didn’t do anything illegal.
On the other hand, if you distribute or use said content for anything other than the intended purposes then what you are doing IS illegal. Distributing obviously is piracy, and using the content from the disc to, say, import characters from SSF4 PC to SF4 PC is a violation of copyrighted materials. Hacking the disc, keeping it to yourself and simply using the DLC without paying isn’t illegal, but it is a violation of the EULA.
For the first time ever agree with him
dlc is dlc what diff does it make
…But not when the dlc is already part of the game and for a few extra dollars you have to unlock the thing.
Most DLC is made alongside the game itself, so that it can be released at what time the publishers think is the right time. That’s how you get Day One DLC, like the extra plots in Arkham City or Mass Effect 3, or the extra characters in Mass Effect 2.
The only real difference between On-Disc DLC and Day One DLC, or any other DLC really, is the manner in which it’s delivered to you. Instead of downloading it from the publisher, it’s already here, and they give you a key for it. Not much different from them delivering the thing to you.
The “few extra dollars” thing though, is another discussion altogether.
They should apply this logic to consoles.
Seriously, Sony busting a dude for hacking into the PS3? Taking out Linux all together? It ain’t your business what people do with their products, only when they mess with your services, douchebags.
My thoughts instinctively turn to SSB Brawl, with boatloads of stuff on the disc (I think the amount of content is reflected in the fact it literally takes 50X the space of other Wii games). I enjoy the content, and games should have collectibles along with it.
I like how it looks for the Wii U too. It may not turn out so, but for Nintendo games it seems like even online multiplayer will release with as much content as possible. I know I’ve heard Nintendo’s thoughts about paid DLC, and I like the direction they had planned. We’ll have to see when they release a content-heavy game
I’m having a hard time believing Michael Pachter said this. I mean it’s something I actually agree with.
this is a landmark occasion, i agree with patcher
PACHTER! YOU HAVE PROBLEMS! YOU JUST SAID SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE AGREE WITH FOR THE FIRST TIME IN SUCH A LONG TIME!
I always download DLC and usually download expansions. Disk is just greed. AGREED PACHTER.
Well Fuck me. That’s the FIRST thing Patcher said that made sence to me.
I actually agree with Patcher on this. It’s like what Nintendo said before about DLC: they’re going to use it to distribute extra content after the game’s launch to keep the game alive along with its replay value. Putting it on the disc then locking it until paid for is just cheap and greedy.
On-disc DLC is only ok for pre-order bonuses that later become FREE DLC. If it’s not what I just described tear that sucker up and take whats yours!
He’s right, but this is also the popular opinion. Nobody likes on disc DLC. So he gets no points. He’s still a douche. Leave luck to heaven.
Pachter love you man, not faggot. What’s with the thumb print on top right of disk?
Pacther said something that makes sense?!
WHAT IS THE WORLD COMING TOO?!!!
Wow, I actually agree with him for once.
Disc Locked Content must be stopped now before it becomes a mainstream habit with 3rd parties. There is no logical reason to “lock” content for future use and then charge for it on top of that. They are diliberately screwing over there fans and ripping them off, and as a gamer I will not tolerate that. I refuse to buy any game that has locked content and I sure as hell won’t pay for it to be unlocked. If you create a game and then later on want to create extra content and sell it by all means go for it. But if you create the content and save it for later for extra money, that means your just a $cumbag company and therefore I don’t want you game or you content!
Turns out he doesn’t always talk rubbish!
Hey, finally something me and Patcher have in common for once!
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